Tory Scum Rebels

[AtW]

Seriously fella, if this is your biggest issue at the moment then you're in a good place so stop whining. Many out there are going to be in fuel poverty, struggle to get by week by week. And you're fixated on the extra bit of tax you may have to start paying again. Suck it up and be thankful that you earn enough to be affected by that tax rate.

Reducing tax from 45% to 40% will actually increase tax take, why would you or anybody else be against that?

[AtW]

There are more important issues than income tax at the moment. You survived until now, so you can survive until the economy is sorted out first.

And how would, exactly, keeping 45% band will help sort out the economy?

Here is HMRC document: https://assets.publishing.service.go...Accessible.pdf

Go to page 26 and observe "costs" of various policy measures:

1. Stopping Rishi's NIC tax grab: around 15 bln per year reduction in taxes
2. 1.25% Dividend tax reversal: around 1 bln per year
3. Removing 1% income tax from 20% to 19% - 5 bln in the first year, later supposedly neutral (now this is BS, it will be the same 5 bln loss per year, it's levied from same base as NICs)
4. Corp tax cancellation - 16-17 bln per year "loss"
5. 45% to 40% - about 2 bln "loss" pear year.

So two items in the list make up for 90% "loss" and it ain't 45% tax reduction, which in my view would certainly make money like it happened when 50% dropped to 45%

[AtW]

And you're fixated on the extra bit of tax you may have to start paying again.

I'll probably be retired by the time Labour comes in 2024, there is a huge incentive to do so.

[malvolio]

And how would, exactly, keeping 45% band will help sort out the economy?

Here is HMRC document: https://assets.publishing.service.go...Accessible.pdf

Go to page 26 and observe "costs" of various policy measures:

1. Stopping Rishi's NIC tax grab: around 15 bln per year reduction in taxes
2. 1.25% Dividend tax reversal: around 1 bln per year
3. Removing 1% income tax from 20% to 19% - 5 bln in the first year, later supposedly neutral (now this is BS, it will be the same 5 bln loss per year, it's levied from same base as NICs)
4. Corp tax cancellation - 16-17 bln per year "loss"
5. 45% to 40% - about 2 bln "loss" pear year.

So two items in the list make up for 90% "loss" and it ain't 45% tax reduction, which in my view would certainly make money like it happened when 50% dropped to 45%

All of which ignores any beneficial effects from having more money in the economy, especially among the better paid, and companies moving in to pick up the lower CT rate. Plus of course the NIC increase and Rishi's NIC tax grab haven't happened, so you're counting that as a drop in income. Gordon Brown would be so proud of your grasp of economics...

[AtW]

All of which ignores any beneficial effects from having more money in the economy, especially among the better paid, and companies moving in to pick up the lower CT rate. Plus of course the NIC increase and Rishi's NIC tax grab haven't happened, so you're counting that as a drop in income. Gordon Brown would be so proud of your grasp of economics...

Already happened from April 2022 - your grasp of what’s happening is truly amazing

Beneficial effects from CT/1%/NICs tax cuts can and should be debated, but the main point I was making that for financial stability these “cuts” are much much bugger than 45% which got all the flak (and it will actually make money unless Labour elected again)

[Whorty]

Reducing tax from 45% to 40% will actually increase tax take, why would you or anybody else be against that?

That may well be the case, but given these Tories are making this change, and every one in the cabinet will personally directly benefit, it's maybe not the best message to give to the poorest in the country. If cutting this tax really does benefit the economy then the Tories could have done it at any time the past 10 years but they chose not to. So are you saying that they only now realise that cutting it to 40% is good for the economy?

Seriously fella, let it go. You've made your point but you're in a minority on here and keep opening the same whiny posts about it isn't going to change anyone's mind.

There are a lot of people in this country who are going to struggle to heat their homes this winter, but all you seem to be concerned about is possibly paying a bit of extra tax on income over £150k It's probably time to get a bit of perspective.

[AtW]

That may well be the case, but given these Tories are making this change, and every one in the cabinet will personally directly benefit, it's maybe not the best message to give to the poorest in the country. If cutting this tax really does benefit the economy then the Tories could have done it at any time the past 10 years but they chose not to. So are you saying that they only now realise that cutting it to 40% is good for the economy?

They (Cameron/Osborne/May/Boris) did not do it because it is politically difficult (as current outcry proves) and they cared more about optics than making right decisions for the economy. It’s a breath of fresh air that Truss is actually doing it.

In terms of energy poverty - that is result of decades of high taxes on North Sea rigs, changing tax rate from 45% from 40% won’t make any difference, other that giving chance to attract new investment and retain current one, which is very important long term.

And if you don’t like it then I’ll tell you more - decades of shifting taxation to the “well off” resulted in massive skew in budget financing, it’s at the maximum of milking that cow, the only way to increase taxes for common public services is to increase taxes on vast majority of residents - that’s the only way tax increases could be kept to a minimum (as it will fall on most people, not few).

That means instead of cutting main tax rate from 20% to 19% it should have gone up a few points (maybe even 25%), plus re-introduce 10% tax rate that existed under Gordon Brown, and/or get VAT to 25% over say 5 years. Now that would generate plenty of tax to keep lefties happy.

It’s about right economic policy, not me - as I said I’ll likely retire in 2024 or even before, because frankly I am tired with this tulipe.

[AtW]

P.S. Govt spending should be cut massively also - completely unsustainable at current levels

[Whorty]

They (Cameron/Osborne/May/Boris) did not do it because it is politically difficult (as current outcry proves) and they cared more about optics than making right decisions for the economy. It’s a breath of fresh air that Truss is actually doing it.

In terms of energy poverty - that is result of decades of high taxes on North Sea rigs, changing tax rate from 45% from 40% won’t make any difference, other that giving chance to attract new investment and retain current one, which is very important long term.

And if you don’t like it then I’ll tell you more - decades of shifting taxation to the “well off” resulted in massive skew in budget financing, it’s at the maximum of milking that cow, the only way to increase taxes for common public services is to increase taxes on vast majority of residents - that’s the only way tax increases could be kept to a minimum (as it will fall on most people, not few).

That means instead of cutting main tax rate from 20% to 19% it should have gone up a few points (maybe even 25%), plus re-introduce 10% tax rate that existed under Gordon Brown, and/or get VAT to 25% over say 5 years. Now that would generate plenty of tax to keep lefties happy.

It’s about right economic policy, not me - as I said I’ll likely retire in 2024 or even before, because frankly I am tired with this tulipe.

Yeah, I'm getting a bit tired of your ranting too ... but still you continue to think those earning over £150k are more deserving of a tax break than those who are on the bottom rung of the earnings scale.

Good for you though. Stick to your principles.

[AtW]

Yeah, I'm getting a bit tired of your ranting too ... but still you continue to think those earning over £150k are more deserving of a tax break than those who are on the bottom rung of the earnings scale.

Where did I say more deserving? I said it will increase total tax take, like it happened when 50% was dropped to 45% - I don’t remember huge outcry about it back then, so why now? It’s better for all taxpayers if total tax rate isn’t too high.

Frankly max income tax level should not be more than 35%, and none od that scam that makes companies pay tax for employing local people, now tax on outsourcing abroad does make sense, but not what’s happening now.