The Saddest Thing About Brexit

[milanbenes]

The Greek crisis was caused mainly by German banks lending recklessly to Greece in order for Greece to buy more German goods. Germany didn't forgo the debt and allow Greece to rebuild or even accept plans that would allow Greece to do this. Greece is selling off the family silver with no hope of getting out of this spiral until it's pretty much a puppet of Germany.

A compassionate Germany would have forgiven part of the debt and allowed Greece to invest and implement modernization so its economy could grow and prosper. Like UK, France and US did with Germany.

umm, er, no, other way around, the Greeks borrowed recklessly

short memories, remember the Olympics in Greece when it wasn't sure even back then if they had enough money to fund it...

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...reeces-decline

yes Germany is happy to lend so that other countries buy their goods and why not ? but don't blame the Germans for reckless lending

Greece's decline began many years before the banking crisis

Funny in this whole conversation nobody is mentioning Cyprus's haircut,

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...reeces-decline

Forbes Welcome

that was the real warning to the pigs... if they didn't get in line, expect what Cyprus got


Milan.

[woohoo]

umm, er, no, other way around, the Greeks borrowed recklessly

short memories, remember the Olympics in Greece when it wasn't sure even back then if they had enough money to fund it...

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...reeces-decline

yes Germany is happy to lend so that other countries buy their goods and why not ? but don't blame the Germans for reckless lending

Greece's decline began many years before the banking crisis

Funny in this whole conversation nobody is mentioning Cyprus's haircut,

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...reeces-decline

Forbes Welcome

that was the real warning to the pigs... if they didn't get in line, expect what Cyprus got


Milan.

You seem to be pasting links right left and center to give your argument some credence.

But you are missing the real point. Firstly, you can blame German banks for lending recklessly, they are getting their money back because their government has basically taken over the country. I don't think that's good banking practice to rely on your government to take over a country so you can get your customers cash back.

Second, there is a moral argument, Germany is doing very well in large part because the allies forgave their debt (most of it) and the US funded much of their rebuilding. Plus any payments where spread over 3 decades so Germany could modernize and rebuild and become rich. Greece is bankrupt, it's selling everything, Germany is not helping Greece to rebuild it's stripping its wealth.

Do you not think that is a terrible thing? Is that an EU that you are proud of?

[milanbenes]

You seem to be pasting links right left and center to give your argument some credence.

But you are missing the real point. Firstly, you can blame German banks for lending recklessly, they are getting their money back because their government has basically taken over the country. I don't think that's good banking practice to rely on your government to take over a country so you can get your customers cash back.

Second, there is a moral argument, Germany is doing very well in large part because the allies forgave their debt (most of it) and the US funded much of their rebuilding. Plus any payments where spread over 3 decades so Germany could modernize and rebuild and become rich. Greece is bankrupt, it's selling everything, Germany is not helping Greece to rebuild it's stripping its wealth.

Do you not think that is a terrible thing? Is that an EU that you are proud of?

umm, you seem to be missing from your history lesson the chapter about how Germany's war reparations included giving up their technology and manufacturing assets, Bristol Cars started out with BMW's complete factory tooling, that's why the Bristol 400 was based upon the BMW 327.

The Jaguar XK120 which we all know and love and which personifies post war Britishness was actually based upon the BMW 328.

That's only the tip of the iceberg, so let's not assume Germany didn't forfeit any of their crown jewels.

Milan.

[shaunbhoy]

so let's not assume Germany didn't forfeit any of their crown jewels.

Milan.

Yes, but they did kinda bring that upon themselves to a large extent.

Just saying.

[milanbenes]

Yes, but they did kinda bring that upon themselves to a large extent.

Just saying.

afternoon Maestro, not denying that, just correcting Yahoo and making sure we don't paint the wrong picture

Milan.

[chopper]

It should not even be a discussion. But it is. And it'll not be amicable. Not in your dreams. Mayhem made it clear yesterday, we don't get our way pram toys will fly.

Do you not think it would be the EU throwing its toys out of the pram, trying to 'punish' Britain from leaving the EU.

We've basically told them that we would like a simpler trading relationship with them, but we don't want all the political bulltulip or to be part of the plans for a single country. You don't need to have a parliament, two parliament buildings, a supreme court, a national anthem, or a flag to achieve that. That is a huge unnecessary burden as part of a gravy train project to create a single country called Europe - you just don't need all of that. The European Court of Justice could be the European Trade Arbitration Service instead, and should have jurisdiction over trade related items.

The fact is we will already comply with all EU law and regulation, so that will be a significant hurdle already overcome. If we say to the EU "We'd like to continue to freely trade with you our goods, services and capital which already comply with European regulations" and they say "hey, no way" then who would be the ones throwing their toys out of the pram? I don't think it would be the British.

It just seems wrong, to me, that some Romanian guy can come over here to wash our cars or pick our lettuces, but not earn enough to pay any tax into the system. Yet he can bring his non-working wife and five kids over and get free access to our health services and our schools, and child benefits which even many British people don't even qualify for.

The fact is that Britain has always been a fly in the EU ointment, we've always been a bit of an outsider in that respect, and have been holding their big project back. They are free to create a single European army and centralise national decision making to a bunch of bureaucrats in Brussels without Britain holding them back.

[Pip in a Poke]

umm, you seem to be missing from your history lesson the chapter about how Germany's war reparations included giving up their technology and manufacturing assets, Bristol Cars started out with BMW's complete factory tooling, that's why the Bristol 400 was based upon the BMW 327.

The Jaguar XK120 which we all know and love and which personifies post war Britishness was actually based upon the BMW 328.

That's only the tip of the iceberg, so let's not assume Germany didn't forfeit any of their crown jewels.

Milan.

Hmmm... Interesting

Didn't know any of that.

Do you remember Wartburgs? They were everywhere at one time. "Ord knows whyu they were so popular. ISTR they had a 2 stroke engine and we're air-cooled.

They were German.

[woohoo]

afternoon Maestro, not denying that, just correcting Yahoo and making sure we don't paint the wrong picture

Milan.

You added a tiny bit to the conversation again missing the point by a million miles and say you are correcting me. It's shameful thing Germany is doing right now and I'm not entirely sure how they are getting away with it. But yep nice to know the Jag is based on the BMW 328.

[woohoo]

Do you not think it would be the EU throwing its toys out of the pram, trying to 'punish' Britain from leaving the EU.

We've basically told them that we would like a simpler trading relationship with them, but we don't want all the political bulltulip or to be part of the plans for a single country. You don't need to have a parliament, two parliament buildings, a supreme court, a national anthem, or a flag to achieve that. That is a huge unnecessary burden as part of a gravy train project to create a single country called Europe - you just don't need all of that. The European Court of Justice could be the European Trade Arbitration Service instead, and should have jurisdiction over trade related items.

The fact is we will already comply with all EU law and regulation, so that will be a significant hurdle already overcome. If we say to the EU "We'd like to continue to freely trade with you our goods, services and capital which already comply with European regulations" and they say "hey, no way" then who would be the ones throwing their toys out of the pram? I don't think it would be the British.

It just seems wrong, to me, that some Romanian guy can come over here to wash our cars or pick our lettuces, but not earn enough to pay any tax into the system. Yet he can bring his non-working wife and five kids over and get free access to our health services and our schools, and child benefits which even many British people don't even qualify for.

The fact is that Britain has always been a fly in the EU ointment, we've always been a bit of an outsider in that respect, and have been holding their big project back. They are free to create a single European army and centralise national decision making to a bunch of bureaucrats in Brussels without Britain holding them back.

Well said.

[milanbenes]

It just seems wrong, to me, that some Romanian guy can come over here to wash our cars or pick our lettuces, but not earn enough to pay any tax into the system. Yet he can bring his non-working wife and five kids over and get free access to our health services and our schools, and child benefits which even many British people don't even qualify for.

and who would be doing it if cheap labour didn't come from Romania ?

you'd either have cheap labour from elsewhere, or dirty cars, I imagine the former.

This is not the EU's fault.

This is the government's fault.

Milan.