EU accepts inevitable informal negotiations before Article 50

[tomtomagain]

No mainstream German or French leader is going to green light single market access for the UK with no free movement. It's just not going happen.

It depends on whether the intent of "Free movement" can be redefined from "From movement of people" to "Free movement of labour that meets a certain threshold".

So for example if you are an EU citizen who can get a job paying £x a month then you'd be welcome into the UK. If you have no job then you wouldn't and you wouldn't have any claim on UK state benefits. It's not that difficult a problem to fix and it doesn't really impact anyone's human rights.

All though there is a lot of noise and bluster it's in everyone's interest to resolve the situation and define a new EU/UK relationship that can continue for another 50 years.

At the moment there is a lot to lose on both sides. But nothing has been lost yet.

[Mordac]

The public sector bods can talk all they like yada yada, meanwhile any international private sector manager of sound mind will certainly not be investing in the UK, unless it is something particular to this small market. There are hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of jobs depending on access to the single market/passporting particularly in manufacturing and finance.
The best we can expect is that existing investors wait and see, what we have started to lose immediately is any planned/proposed investment that was dependent on access to the single market.

This will become in obvious in the FDI figures in the months and years to come, a permanent shrinkage of the economy.

And the Cretin has woken up. Cue "end of intelligent discussion" and switch to "moron mode".

[CretinWatcher]

And the Cretin has woken up. Cue "end of intelligent discussion" and switch to "moron mode".

I rest my case.

[VectraMan]

It depends on whether the intent of "Free movement" can be redefined from "From movement of people" to "Free movement of labour that meets a certain threshold".

So for example if you are an EU citizen who can get a job paying £x a month then you'd be welcome into the UK. If you have no job then you wouldn't and you wouldn't have any claim on UK state benefits. It's not that difficult a problem to fix and it doesn't really impact anyone's human rights.

It's not free movement of labour if you're required to have a job lined up before hand. But more importantly all those people that were convinced they had to vote to leave to stop migrant workers taking "their jobs" are going to be a little miffed if migrant workers continue to take their jobs in the same numbers.

[GB9]

I note a general dislike of Juncker from all sides.

Of course the UK opposed his election but was outvoted.

From reports it appears he insisted that only he and the Commission were involved in negotiations with Cameron prior to the vote. And he stuck to his federalist regime.

I wonder if other EU leaders had negotiated whether the outcome may have been different. It's no wonder Merkel wants shot of him.

[darmstadt]

So for example if you are an EU citizen who can get a job paying £x a month then you'd be welcome into the UK. If you have no job then you wouldn't and you wouldn't have any claim on UK state benefits. It's not that difficult a problem to fix and it doesn't really impact anyone's human rights.

Like this: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/e...iversal-credit

From today (9 March 2015), new EU migrants who have arrived in the UK will be prevented from claiming benefits until they have started work.

Or this:

It consists of a mechanism to “limit the access of union workers newly entering its labour market to in-work benefits for a total period of up to four years from the commencement of employment” if the UK, or any other member state, can show that EU migrants are “putting an excessive pressure on the proper functioning of its public services”.

https://www.gov.uk/government/speech...-february-2016

[CretinWatcher]

It's not free movement of labour if you're required to have a job lined up before hand. But more importantly all those people that were convinced they had to vote to leave to stop migrant workers taking "their jobs" are going to be a little miffed if migrant workers continue to take their jobs in the same numbers.

The elephant in the room here is that we could stop all migration tomorrow, and the 50% of the population with an IQ below 100 (by definition) would still not be able to fill the vacancies in the knowledge economy. No amount of education and training is going to convert someone with an IQ of 90 into a tulip hot developer, analyst, scientist, or doctor.

All that would happen is that companies would move elsewhere where they can get skilled and educated workers.

I'm a Tory voter but even I can see this was the strategic flaw in Thatcher's push for the "service" economy and destruction of factory jobs.

That's why this revolt by the stupid is ultimately doomed - they are not going to get what they hoped for because it is impossible.

[NotAllThere]

The elephant in the room here is that we could stop all migration tomorrow, and the 50% of the population with an IQ below 100 (by definition) would still not be able to fill the vacancies in the knowledge economy. No amount of education and training is going to convert someone with an IQ of 90 into a tulip hot developer, analyst, scientist, or doctor..

You perpetuate the lie that migrants are overall useful to the economy, when everyone knows that they're all feckless itinerant types just coming to the UK to bleed the benefit system, use the NHS and send their child allowances home to support their eight or nine children by four different women.

[DodgyAgent]

[QUOTE=CretinWatcher;2283671 any international private sector manager of sound mind will certainly not be investing in the UK, [/QUOTE]

Germany's Siemens makes long-term commitment to UK after Brexit vote | City A.M.

Siemens chief executive Joe Kaeser has vowed to continue investing in the UK after the EU referendum result.

He told the Telegraph: “We’re here for the long-term and we don’t let ourselves get jerked up and down. We’re staying because the UK is a good place to do business.”


Apart from a "manager" at Europes biggest Enginerring company

[tomtomagain]

It's not free movement of labour if you're required to have a job lined up before hand. But more importantly all those people that were convinced they had to vote to leave to stop migrant workers taking "their jobs" are going to be a little miffed if migrant workers continue to take their jobs in the same numbers.

It might not be the same definition as it is now. But having the requirement for a job before migrating to a country is not really a big deal.

A minority won't be happy. But then they'd never be happy. However the majority just want to feel that there is some level of government control.