Alexander Mann!!

[malvolio]

Let's just say I wonder how often AM get paid by the client.
I wouldn't like to think they bank the money and hold on to the interest?

It's the same with these new rules on Holiday pay from Umbrellas (luckily mine doesn't do this)
But I want all the money due, and as soon as possible

(Sound of dull thudding noises from Malvolio's cupboard under the stairs....)

With attitudes like that, it makes it very hard to think why some of us are trying to get the world to accept us as thinking professionals and why BigCo only wants to deal with the agency.

And BTW, I suspect AMS, like most agencies, get paid on the usual commercial terms, most likely 90 days after invoice. If anything they're losing money to pay you in a month.

[Paddy]

Let's just say I wonder how often AM get paid by the client.
I wouldn't like to think they bank the money and hold on to the interest?

It's the same with these new rules on Holiday pay from Umbrellas (luckily mine doesn't do this)
But I want all the money due, and as soon as possible

Most large projects, like with Capgemini are paid up in advance. EG £500,000 for six months supply of contractors.

[malvolio]

Well you learn something new every day, don't you... Never seen that happen in 15 years of high-level contract negotiation: letter of intent, yes, money in the bank before the first deliverable milestone, no. Would you sign up for that if you were the client?

Then again, even if you're right, I'll give you good odds they don't pay their suppliers up front.

[Lean Dipstick]

30 Days

Well, hang on. 14 days is not unreasonable to ask for, is it?

It is 30 days, AMS told me so today. In other words, start a contract and don't get paid for five weeks. On my last contract I worked with a guy who was with them previously and he had to wait seven weeks. I think it was because he started a week after their month-end. Reasonable or not, that's potentially a lot of money to lose if anything 'goes wrong'.

[DaveB]

It is 30 days, AMS told me so today. In other words, start a contract and don't get paid for five weeks. On my last contract I worked with a guy who was with them previously and he had to wait seven weeks. I think it was because he started a week after their month-end. Reasonable or not, that's potentially a lot of money to lose if anything 'goes wrong'.

Sounds perfectly reasonable. Just be glad it's not 30 days from date of invoice as it would be for a commercial supplier.

My agent is the same. I send them my invoice for the previous months work, they pay me between 3-5 days later depending on the status of their payment process when my invoice arrives. They certainly dont get paid in that time scale by the end client.

As for payment up front, CG will try it on if they think they can get away with it. I've worked on sites where they have a presence, it's a bit like rotton cabbage crossed with a sewage farm, and have worked with their management people. They are sharks like all the other big services/consultancy companies. Whether the client is good enough to bend over and get shafted is up to them. I've heard CEO's describing them as raping the their company through the contract terms the got away with.

BTW, the guys who actually do the grunt work for CG are by and large nice guys who do a good job under difficult circumstances. Most of them would leave in a second if they got the chance.

[BoredBloke]

I thought that one of the benefits of using an agency was to speed up payment. Part of their margin was to provide a very expensive factoring service. When I worked direct to GSK, they had a 30 day rule and paid after that. So if the agency is simply deducting their cut and passing the cash on, then they should be reducing their margin.

On my current contract I got caught by this. I managed to get it down by talking to the client. I don't know if AM would do this though. I guess it depends how much the client wants you.

Also this does screw you up. Especially if you have come from a period on the bench, or as I had doen worked on a low paid contract for an extended period. Both of which reduce the funds in your slush fund.

[mcquiggd]

As i said earlier in the thread, 30 days AFTER you start work, you can invoice for that period. Then they amble around a bit and take a week to process it. Eventually, they pay you, once they have nabbed a nice chunk of interest on your money.

After the first month, you CAN invoice weekly - as I remember you have to get your invoice in for tuesday lunchtime, get paid by BACS, eventually.

[OrangeHopper]

Permies only get paid on a 4 weekly cycle (and worse at Christmas).

60 days from day 1 to first cheque then every month thereafter was the expectation and could represent the best of payers.

[Joe Black]

Currently on something similar to this, i.e. won't be paid for August until first week Oct, but then thats the deal when you generally don't have an agency involved and are considered simply another supplier. Get paid more but don't have the niceties mcquiggd mentioned about faxing Friday, money in bank following week.

In the case of AM though, I think I'd agree with two points raised:

1) that if they're charging a hefty premium for your work then it's not unreasonable to push for flexibility on that point
2) if you're expected to be treated as just another supplier (especially if a first time one), you have every right to question their liquidity and credit check them

[mcquiggd]

Tends to be "email friday (if your project manager gets round to approving it), wait until tuesday as you have had no confirmation, ring up and get no answer, wait for the friday to see if any more is in the bank account, ring up monday and see if you can find out if they received the email (you dont get a read receipt".

alexander mann are used by atos origin - need I say more.