Testers

[GlenSausio]

I just wouldn't get into programming: because it's been offshored so much, there are now better paid jobs which have stayed onshore such as business analysis and a lot of testing.

However, if you must then you have to go for the programming languages which are hard to learn such as those which are functional (Clojure) or deal with hard topics such as concurrency (Scala). I found it was functional and multithreaded programming which really separated the good programmers from the merely average. You've got to be in the top quarter of your peer group on the course to be in with a chance.

But remember that programming languages come and go and it's hard to convince an agent that you have transferable skills. Instead consider OSs like UNIX which have been around for the long haul, or perhaps a language like JavaScript.

I wouldn't advise any newbie to get into scala or clojure. Just not enough jobs to be viable. Also, JAVA is slowly encorporating these languages selling points and is a much more useful CV addition.

Programming is still good because it's a transferable skill across industries. BA/tester work is not as transferable- they tend to specialise on a market. But you have to be a bit careful about which programming jobs to accept. Stay away from purely techie jobs with no business exposure, they are more easily outsourceable. Ask where you will be seated. If you are next to the DBA and SysAdmin run a mile. If you are near the actual business, could be OK. Programming is still largely a meritocracy, BA is a semi-sales role and more polished youngsters get an advantage.

[Zero Liability]

I just wouldn't get into programming: because it's been offshored so much, there are now better paid jobs which have stayed onshore such as business analysis and a lot of testing.

However, if you must then you have to go for the programming languages which are hard to learn such as those which are functional (Clojure) or deal with hard topics such as concurrency (Scala). I found it was functional and multithreaded programming which really separated the good programmers from the merely average. You've got to be in the top quarter of your peer group on the course to be in with a chance.

But remember that programming languages come and go and it's hard to convince an agent that you have transferable skills. Instead consider OSs like UNIX which have been around for the long haul, or perhaps a language like JavaScript.

Well in all honesty I am comparing the option of a career change to IT with the alternative of going into accountancy, perhaps through a Big 4 grad scheme, or with one of the other top 20 practices. I would still like to pick up a programming language, even if I choose not to go into programming, as it's becoming increasingly important to know this sort of thing. Java is by far the one that is suggested to me the most for entry-level stuff.

[eek]

Well in all honesty I am comparing the option of a career change to IT with the alternative of going into accountancy, perhaps through a Big 4 grad scheme, or with one of the other top 20 practices. I would still like to pick up a programming language, even if I choose not to go into programming, as it's becoming increasingly important to know this sort of thing. Java is by far the one that is suggested to me the most for entry-level stuff.

If you are using programming as part of another skill set a scripting language such as python or javascript would be a better bet...

[GlenSausio]

Well in all honesty I am comparing the option of a career change to IT with the alternative of going into accountancy, perhaps through a Big 4 grad scheme, or with one of the other top 20 practices. I would still like to pick up a programming language, even if I choose not to go into programming, as it's becoming increasingly important to know this sort of thing. Java is by far the one that is suggested to me the most for entry-level stuff.

If you want to thrive as a programmer, you are in for a hard life. You are going to have to learn a lot of sh1t then get 10 years experience to become good enough to bill high rates. You are not even a hobbyist programmer. I wouldn't bother. It's not the job it once was -fewer perks, less respect, smaller projects. How old are you? Most programmers are under 30- smart arses- do you want to compete in that environment?

[Zero Liability]

Under 30, but like I said even if I don't go into it for a career change I do want to come to grips with it.

[The Spartan]

Under 30, but like I said even if I don't go into it for a career change I do want to come to grips with it.

Good on you, I learned how to program in Ruby a few years back and I've not looked back it's been onwards and upwards, I've also started to learn Javascript, JQuery and a host of other things and if anything they've made the work I do a lot easier.

[woohoo]

If you want to thrive as a programmer, you are in for a hard life. You are going to have to learn a lot of sh1t then get 10 years experience to become good enough to bill high rates. You are not even a hobbyist programmer. I wouldn't bother. It's not the job it once was -fewer perks, less respect, smaller projects. How old are you? Most programmers are under 30- smart arses- do you want to compete in that environment?

Really pessimistic. Programming/developing or whatever you want to call it, is a very rewarding and creative profession.

I've found it hard trying to hire even jnr developers and have had to look outside of the country (they are still asking for decent salaries). So, it can't be that hard to get into.

I reckon pick a technology, learn it, get a full time jnr role and within 3 years you could charge decent rates. Get into a niche even better.

[vetran]

Well in all honesty I am comparing the option of a career change to IT with the alternative of going into accountancy, perhaps through a Big 4 grad scheme, or with one of the other top 20 practices. I would still like to pick up a programming language, even if I choose not to go into programming, as it's becoming increasingly important to know this sort of thing. Java is by far the one that is suggested to me the most for entry-level stuff.

Learn Excel VBA & SQL you will be the Darling of the Finance team!

[SussexSeagull]

Agree re deadlines being more aggressive but I think that is a fall out of bobification.

The key is to get the code into testing within the SLA - if it is then sh*t, so what - the deadline of getting the code in for testing has been met so job done.

In addition the tighter deadlines have meant you need more than one developer on the same parts of the code and thus need to merge code which means the developers individual unit tests may have passed on their own but not together.

Still as long as everyone agrees testing is mandatory we should get along just fine!

I think deadlines are ultimately a product of companies tending to go to the lowest bidder and not considering track record of delivery.

[original PM]

Learn Excel VBA & SQL you will be the Darling of the Finance team!

Or you will create a myriad of ridiculously complex spreadsheets as a work around when the system inevitably does not do what is needed