Zero Zero Society

[vetran]

Exploitation of workers is probably at an all time high since the eighties.

Zero hour contracts and employees disguised as self employed are endemic. This is a far cry from highly paid contractors. People have to rent their van etc off the employer at inflated rates then work 60-80 hours to pay for it.

You effectively become a Franchisee without being able to serve multiple customers.

You have to turn up for work at your own expense then get sent home unpaid because there is no work. This can mean losing £10 a day for no work at NMW.

Desperate people are being forced to pay to work. Guess what? it really started under New Labour.

I wouldn't trust New Lie to sort it out.

If you cut the number willing to work for a pittance then the abuse will reduce. Any ideas how to do that hey DeadhED? Oh maybe stop sending out search parties for cheap labour.

[Project Monkey]

Exploitation of workers is probably at an all time high since the eighties.

Zero hour contracts and employees disguised as self employed are endemic. This is a far cry from highly paid contractors. People have to rent their van etc off the employer at inflated rates then work 60-80 hours to pay for it.

You effectively become a Franchisee without being able to serve multiple customers.

You have to turn up for work at your own expense then get sent home unpaid because there is no work. This can mean losing £10 a day for no work at NMW.

Desperate people are being forced to pay to work. Guess what? it really started under New Labour.

I wouldn't trust New Lie to sort it out.

If you cut the number willing to work for a pittance then the abuse will reduce. Any ideas how to do that hey DeadhED? Oh maybe stop sending out search parties for cheap labour.

You sound just like Ed.

[vetran]

You sound just like Ed.

If I sounded like Ed I would deny any responsibility and blame it on the Tories.

The fact is there that people are being exploited, where we differ in opinion is on who we think are responsible and how to solve it.

[Project Monkey]

Are you being deliberately obtuse, or do you not work through a Ltd which pays you a fixed salary?
Comparing a contractor to someone stacking shelves in Tesco has to be trolling, right?



Anyway, I think the zero-hours culture is a problem but I'm not sure about the zero tax side of things; I'm sure there are people getting away with murder but that it's not ubiquitous.

Yes, I am but the point remains that zero-hours contracts are not necessarily a bad thing. I choose to work this way, but if Ed gets his way and brings about the changes he dreams about, I will no longer have this choice.

[vetran]

Yes, I am but the point remains that zero-hours contracts are not necessarily a bad thing. I choose to work this way, but if Ed gets his way and brings about the changes he dreams about, I will no longer have this choice.

You are on a Zero hour contract of employment ?

Or is your Ltd in a contract for services with your client?

these are very different things.

[d000hg]

Yes, I am but the point remains that zero-hours contracts are not necessarily a bad thing. I choose to work this way, but if Ed gets his way and brings about the changes he dreams about, I will no longer have this choice.

But most people working these things aren't choosing to, other than that they're choosing between that or no job at all.

If it would benefit a large number of lowly paid people who are taken advantage of, but disadvantage a few who are using it for their own advantage, even an outright ban would still be better.

[Doggy Styles]

My plumber is on a zero hours contract. If no-one calls him he doesn't work.

[Contreras]

Yes, I am but the point remains that zero-hours contracts are not necessarily a bad thing. I choose to work this way, but if Ed gets his way and brings about the changes he dreams about, I will no longer have this choice.

My plumber is on a zero hours contract. If no-one calls him he doesn't work.

Zero-hour contract at NMW is quite a different story to zero-hour contract at £50/hr. The later has various risks priced in. Why does policy have to fail to recognise that and we end up with weak protection for those who need it and more useless red tape for those who don't?

[vetran]

My plumber is on a zero hours contract. If no-one calls him he doesn't work.

Your plumber is self employed or the MD / employee of his own limited.

He has a choice to work for others and you have little Direction & control over him.

This is different to people on below the NMW turning up in the hope of being paid for a days work with only one employer.

[original PM]

Your plumber is self employed or the MD / employee of his own limited.

He has a choice to work for others and you have little Direction & control over him.

This is different to people on below the NMW turning up in the hope of being paid for a days work with only one employer.

I do not have a huge issue with the zero hours contracts if you are giving people a few hours notice they are not working so they do not need to spend money to get to the place of work.

However sadly back in the day when I worked in recruitment if I wanted to guarantee 5 people would turn up for work I would have to send 6 or 7 as you can 100% guarantee that 1 or 2 would simply not bother getting out of bed.

All these people who offer zero hours contracts are covering their arses because the staff who are employed to turn up do not and so the shop is short staffed, customers get poor service and so no repeat business.

It would seem 1 is a defence against the other and I think people not bothering to get out of bed came before zero hours contracts (in the modern world!)