I thought children were supposed to be a blessing?

[DodgyAgent]

We are supposed to live in a civilised democracy and yes sometimes the ends do justify the means and maybe this behaviour was necessary to achieve the desired ends. But I am afraid that within our democracy everyone has certain rights and for an individual to be exploited in such a manner by the government then the consequences have to be paid for.

[mudskipper]

But then we strayed into 'he was a filthy rapist territory' and comparing morality and law amongst normal people rather than trying on the shoes of people who spend their life being someone else to prevent your comfortable life being disrupted by terrorism.

You asked what crime he had may have committed. It was pointed out that he could be accused of rape, which, if you look at case histories, he could. If he was, he may or may not be found guilty.

Personally, I don't think he's a filthy rapist. He is, however, a proper scumbag. That's not unusual. Being a scumbag with the blessing of the state is what makes this case different.

[SueEllen]

We are supposed to live in a civilised democracy and yes sometimes the ends do justify the means and maybe this behaviour was necessary to achieve the desired ends. But I am afraid that within our democracy everyone has certain rights and for an individual to be exploited in such a manner by the government then the consequences have to be paid for.

Lefty!

[MaryPoppins]

Personally, I don't think he's a filthy rapist. He is, however, a proper scumbag. That's not unusual. Being a scumbag with the blessing of the state is what makes this case different.

What she said, as usual, very well.

[DodgyAgent]

Lefty!

[original PM]

Shagging around is one thing. Almost inevitable by your reasoning.

Having a long term relationship and a child with someone is a bit different, and doesn't appear to have formed part of his professional remit.

I wasn't commenting on the amount of money the woman was paid, simply on the morality of his actions.

Exactly he acted of his own volition and not under direct orders from the his superiors therefore why is his 'company' being punished for what he did?

And now are we being told me that every man who has spun a lady a few lines to get into her pants is now a rapist?

[vetran]

Exactly he acted of his own volition and not under direct orders from the his superiors therefore why is his 'company' being punished for what he did?

And now are we being told me that every man who has spun a lady a few lines to get into her pants is now a rapist?

Thanks someone who understands some of my points. But You can't say things like that about the poor lady who loves fluffy bunnies.

From the original link:

former Special Branch detective Bob Lambert, used the pseudonym Bob Robinson, and was tasked with infiltrating the Animal Liberation Front.
During that operation in the mid 1980s, he formed a relationship with a 22-year-old activist called Jacqui

not "a completely innocent animal lover" you might note.

Lets get some background on the ALF.

FBI — Animal Rights Extremism and Ecoterrorism

The American branch of the ALF began its operations in the late 1970s. Individuals become members of the ALF not by filing paperwork or paying dues, but simply by engaging in "direct action" against companies or individuals who, in their view, utilize animals for research or economic gain, or do some manner of business with those companies or individuals. "Direct action" generally occurs in the form of criminal activity designed to cause economic loss or to destroy the victims' company operations or property.

I think you lot are missing the point this isn't some cuddly girl in wellies shouting save Peter Rabbit!

FBI — Using Intel Against Eco-Terrorists

And a UK angle from that rightist rag the Granuid

Questions remain over animal rights activists' case | UK news | The Guardian

By 1987, Lambert had infiltrated the small ALF cell co-ordinating arson attacks on stores in protest against their sale of fur.

note the date its important.

From the original article

In 1985 she gave birth - but when the boy was two years old, the father vanished.

1985 + 2 = 1987 when he locked up some arsonists from the ALF and blew his cover. Sorry cruelly dumped the wholly innocent bunny lover.

Of course they have been wriggling on this hook for a while:

What is likely to prove more controversial is the suggestion, relayed by the MP, that Lambert may have gone further than a mere observer, and planted the third incendiary device in order to bolster his credibility and "reinforce the impression of a genuine and dedicated activist".

That is an allegation that Lambert has firmly denied. He told the Guardian: "It was necessary to create the false impression that I was a committed animal rights extremist to gain intelligence so as to disrupt serious criminal conspiracies. However, I did not commit serious crime such as 'planting an incendiary device at the [Debenhams] Harrow store'."

so he should have just told Jacqui the bunny lover he was a bobby and they could all have had cake and lashings of Ginger beer.. FFS you lot are naive.

I understand that his behavior in a normal social circle would reasonably result him in being ostracised and possibly prosecuted but these people were arsonists and much worse!

Again I ask should we give Martin McGuinness a few hundred grand??

[mudskipper]

I might have missed it - what crime was Jacqui convicted of?

[DaveB]

Thanks someone who understands some of my points. But You can't say things like that about the poor lady who loves fluffy bunnies.

From the original link:



not "a completely innocent animal lover" you might note.

Lets get some background on the ALF.

FBI — Animal Rights Extremism and Ecoterrorism



I think you lot are missing the point this isn't some cuddly girl in wellies shouting save Peter Rabbit!

FBI — Using Intel Against Eco-Terrorists

And a UK angle from that rightist rag the Granuid

Questions remain over animal rights activists' case | UK news | The Guardian



note the date its important.

From the original article



1985 + 2 = 1987 when he locked up some arsonists from the ALF and blew his cover. Sorry cruelly dumped the wholly innocent bunny lover.

Of course they have been wriggling on this hook for a while:



so he should have just told Jacqui the bunny lover he was a bobby and they could all have had cake and lashings of Ginger beer.. FFS you lot are naive.

I understand that his behavior in a normal social circle would reasonably result him in being ostracised and possibly prosecuted but these people were arsonists and much worse!

Again I ask should we give Martin McGuinness a few hundred grand??

All completely irrelevant in terms of any offences he may have committed against her. Or are we getting into ends justifying means territory now? No one at any point has said she was a saint. That does not mean that she cannot be the victim of a crime and entitled to restitution like anyone else.

[TheFaQQer]

Again I ask should we give Martin McGuinness a few hundred grand??

What crime was he a victim of?

I suspect that if he were a victim, then he would have taken professional legal advice and sued whoever he could to get what he wants from the system.