Apparently there is a public sector strike going on...

[DodgyAgent]

A fed-up teacher's take on the strike;

NUT teachers strike: I am among the thousands leaving teaching today. This is why. - Comment - Voices - The Independent





Taylorism in action. That's what led to the union militancy of the 70s and the 'blue collar blues', and it's happening in white collar jobs. It's not just teachers that are sick to the back teeth of spreadsheet management and this culture of top-down suspicion and control.

The education system for most of our kids in the public sector is crap. Unless they are bright like you lot and can go to grammar school life is very hard unless they are lucky enough to be in an area with an outstanding school. How then do you measure whether a teacher is any good or not? They can write whatever they like and indeed some of them might have a point. The truth is that unless there is some sort of measurement know one will know. Not knowing how a teacher performs means that the school cannot improve.

Whilst it is entirely right that the blame for a poor school is at the top it is also right that those at the top with responsibility for educating our children should themselves be measured as well as have the tools with which to manage down the chain of command. If there is suspicion it is probably as a result of poor performance by the school.

[lilelvis2000]

Did anyone notice that ?

Kids' school was off so yes, I did notice it.

Missus also tried to use the local gym and it was also closed..it's inside the council leisure centre.

And client didn't have any work to hand to me..so earned nil.

A very productive day indeed..

[vetran]

well if they don't measure themselves their customers will.

CBI: Employers want education system to better prepare young people for life outside school gates

In the survey of 291 companies employing nearly 1.5 million people, over half (61%) are concerned about the resilience and self-management of school leavers and a third (33%) with their attitude to work. By contrast, nearly all firms (96%) are satisfied with young peoples’ IT abilities when they enter the workplace.

Firms want primary schools to focus on developing literacy and numeracy (85%) with around one-third not satisfied with these skills among school leavers. Half (52%) are urging schools to develop a greater awareness of working life among 14-19 year olds with support from businesses. Companies are prepared to play their part with two-thirds (66%) willing to take on a larger role in the school careers system.

basic stuff they are failing at.

now compare that to 2012

CBI: Further progress on school and college leaver attainment requires radical new vision - CBI / Pearson

When asked which areas of education they think primary schools should focus on, 61% of employers said numeracy, 58% writing, 45% reading, and 42% said communication skills. For secondary schools, employers say the main focus should be on developing broader skills for working life:

Employability skills – 71%
Literacy – 50%
Numeracy - 45%

I regularly fill in stupid spreadsheets for 'pointless statistics' its part of the pay cheque.

I'm all for signing up for the international Baccalaureate and seeing how the teachers cope.

[original PM]

The education system for most of our kids in the public sector is crap. Unless they are bright like you lot and can go to grammar school life is very hard unless they are lucky enough to be in an area with an outstanding school. How then do you measure whether a teacher is any good or not? They can write whatever they like and indeed some of them might have a point. The truth is that unless there is some sort of measurement know one will know. Not knowing how a teacher performs means that the school cannot improve.

Whilst it is entirely right that the blame for a poor school is at the top it is also right that those at the top with responsibility for educating our children should themselves be measured as well as have the tools with which to manage down the chain of command. If there is suspicion it is probably as a result of poor performance by the school.

Actually the education system in this country is pretty damn good.

Yes some schools are sh*te but then if you look you will find it is because the parents do not support the kids or the school.

The vast majority of teachers can teach very well what makes their job diffuclt especially now is when you get one or two unruly kids (they may be given a label like ADHD or something but in reality they are just naughty little sh*ts) and so teacher spends most the time sprting these two out and so the rest of the class suffers.

You want a decent schooling system - you have one now lets see if you can produce some decent human beings to take advantage of what it offers.

[xoggoth]

All in favour of merit, there is no doubt that bad teachers are far too hard to get rid of. However, there has become far too much of a tick box mentality that is turning off good teachers and, more importantly, the kids themselves. Generating enthusiasm for learning is important too. Some say we need all these rigid controls but British education seemed to do a lot better a few decades ago when we didn't have them.

[TheFaQQer]

basic stuff they are failing at.

Define failing. Your quote says "Firms want primary schools to focus on developing literacy and numeracy (85%) with around one-third not satisfied with these skills among school leavers."

I don't think many primary teachers want to have children leaving school who are illiterate and innumerate, to be honest.

If they want schools to focus on developing literacy and numeracy, then maybe they should be lobbying the government to stop playing about with the primary curriculum each year and allow schools to focus on those areas. From September, primary schools will have to teach computer programming and a foreign language, plus have a revised history curriculum to deal with which runs chronologically putting the focus on Britain in history. There may be other changes to the curriculum, but these are the immediate ones which spring to mind.

Does the CBI believe that teaching synthetic phonics helps literacy, or hinders it? In the eyes of the CBI, does testing whether children at the age of 6 can read phonetically (including made up words) add to or restrict the knowledge and understanding within literacy?

[TheFaQQer]

All in favour of merit, there is no doubt that bad teachers are far too hard to get rid of.

That used to be the case, but these days there are fewer restrictions on schools being able to sack poor teachers.

Part of the problem comes from trying to recruit replacements for them - particularly in areas where there is a teacher shortage. If you can't get someone in as a replacement, then the school has a difficult decision - what can you do with a useless member of staff if there is no-one else that can do the job? But that's not a problem which is restricted to teaching.

[Mich the Tester]

Actually the education system in this country is pretty damn good.

Yes some schools are sh*te but then if you look you will find it is because the parents do not support the kids or the school.

The vast majority of teachers can teach very well what makes their job diffuclt especially now is when you get one or two unruly kids (they may be given a label like ADHD or something but in reality they are just naughty little sh*ts) and so teacher spends most the time sprting these two out and so the rest of the class suffers.

You want a decent schooling system - you have one now lets see if you can produce some decent human beings to take advantage of what it offers.

I think you might be right. I've seen other education systems in Europe and while they appear to produce 'results' for the large group of average-ish kids, they can also lead to a mechanistic thinking about the world ("if we do A and B according to standard C and everybody follows the 'best practises then everything will work efficiently")that I don't see so much among people schooled in the English, Irish or US systems.

I work with people who are very, very competent in what they do, but ask them to consider the social consequences of the work we do and they're lost; lots of Dutch workers are good when it comes to maths and logic or reciting historical dates, but try to bring literature or art into a discussion about work and they don't see the relevance. I gave a talk in Dublin once to testers once about so-called 'structured testing' and CMMI and the like, Taylorism and dystopian literature; the Irish and the Brits seemed to understand exactly what I was saying; the Dutch and Germans just stared blankly and one of them asked me 'what on earth were you on about?' I allowed one of the Irish guys to answer him as he did so more eloquently than I could.

I think British education amounts to 'you get out what you put in'; if parents are involved constructively and explain to their kids the how and why of learning then it could do much better.

[DodgyAgent]

Actually the education system in this country is pretty damn good.

Yes some schools are sh*te but then if you look you will find it is because the parents do not support the kids or the school.

The vast majority of teachers can teach very well what makes their job diffuclt especially now is when you get one or two unruly kids (they may be given a label like ADHD or something but in reality they are just naughty little sh*ts) and so teacher spends most the time sprting these two out and so the rest of the class suffers.

You want a decent schooling system - you have one now lets see if you can produce some decent human beings to take advantage of what it offers.

I don't know where you get the idea that the education system in the UK is "pretty damn good"

OECD education report: subject results in full - Telegraph

[DodgyAgent]

Define failing. Your quote says "Firms want primary schools to focus on developing literacy and numeracy (85%) with around one-third not satisfied with these skills among school leavers."

I don't think many primary teachers want to have children leaving school who are illiterate and innumerate, to be honest.

If they want schools to focus on developing literacy and numeracy, then maybe they should be lobbying the government to stop playing about with the primary curriculum each year and allow schools to focus on those areas. From September, primary schools will have to teach computer programming and a foreign language, plus have a revised history curriculum to deal with which runs chronologically putting the focus on Britain in history. There may be other changes to the curriculum, but these are the immediate ones which spring to mind.

Does the CBI believe that teaching synthetic phonics helps literacy, or hinders it? In the eyes of the CBI, does testing whether children at the age of 6 can read phonetically (including made up words) add to or restrict the knowledge and understanding within literacy?

I think what the CBI wants is basic maths and decent english and high aspirations. If kids have got these they can do anything