first contract advice...

[northernladuk]

thanks for the replies.

I was hoping for some constructive advice from the more experienced as this is my first contract and I am the first to admit I am new to contracting as a LTD company. I know my chosen career, not the ins and outs of every aspect of contracting, this is why I asked here. I realise I have made mistakes / poor choices but flogging me over it doesn't really help anyone. I do appreciate anything constructive anyone wants to take their own time to explain to me and I can learn from.

While looking for a new role, I was offered a good rate with a good client on a project I enjoy. It was at very very short notice. To take it I had to put everything in place over a weekend.

When the agency send me the paperwork is out of my control. I "could" have delayed the start date, but I chose not to. I didn't envisage it would cause me too many problems. That was my choice rightly or wrongly.

I hope to build up the skills to make the right decision every time but that comes with experience.

As to IR35. Thank you for picking up on it, the contract states I must correct my mistakes at my own cost, it also states I must supply another contractor if i cannot attend. I believe these are adequate for defining I am outside IR35?

I will take a look at the link - thank you. any other advice would be welcome - ty.

Are you sure about that? You know enough about IR35 to come to that conclusion?

Send it off to QDOS to get it checked. If you get PI/PL through them you get the review for free as well. As mentioned before if it fails you will be inside IR35 and need to re-think your accounting unless you want to just act outside and hope you don't get caught.

[malvolio]

While people are being blunt, they are also pretty much correct in what they're saying. You seem to have missed one fairly important point: your job is no longer whatever the client pays you to do, your job is being a contractor and, in your case, a Company director. Which means (a) you have responisbilities you haven't even thought of yet and (b) you are the only one responsible for you.

I suggest you read the guide on this site and the one on the PCG website (www.pcg.org.uk) and perhaps take a look at the accountants' ones on the SJD and Nixon Williams sites. Then perhaps you can ask sensible questions.

Substituion and correction for free are good pointers, but they are not definitive; in IR35, nothing is definitive. You don't know enough t to make a judgement and while the Parity contract is fairly good, it don't matter a damn if it doesn't match reality.

As for the current gig, you're on a day rate which means no overtime; you get paid the same for one hour or 23.5 hours in any 24 hour period. Book 8 hours a day and get paid for one day's work and that's it. As others have said, you've accepted the contract in its entirety, it ain't going to change until renewal.

HTH.

[josh1e]

thanks northernlad. I'll get in touch with them,

molvolio, i don't mind the day rate. I said I was happy with it. overtime isn't important to me for this contract. I wanted to know if it would cause any problems or if i missed something / it could cause me grief.

thanks.

[northernladuk]

Has your accountant not asked about your contract and/or IR35 status?

[josh1e]

@ northernlad,

No accountant yet. I only got first info about the role Mon, thurs interview, the offer fri am & contracts fri pm.. I thought it would be a week or so before start date but client in hurry. I had to put everything in place over the weekend and started monday. Now it's in place & first week went so well, thinking I like contracting and having more control... Would like to not be rushed & ensure for next contract I don't make same mistakes.

Nope, I agree, I don't know IR35 like an accountant, but I think I understand to some extent how they make decisions or the rational they use. Sure there is alot of loopholes and places to be caught out. Do you know if their is service to have agency contract's looked over for legal clauses / unreasonable clauses & ir35?

Have an appt with an accountant 1st feb. They fully booked before then. I had seen links on here for some, might contact 1-2 to see if they have closer appt's & rates..

It's been all rush rush from client, Not sure if ppl got wrong end of stick.. I'm not complaining about my contract or daily rate or lack of o/t pay. I am happy with rate and contract (as much as I understand it). I wondered if any other parity contractors had problems, re-neged certain parts of the contract, could tell me things to look out for, or had any other advice I would very likely have missed or not even thought about.

(for example I got caught out on opt out of agency code of conduct, didn't even know what it was before they ensured I had signed it! I thought it was 40hr opt out!! my mistake. Won't be so quick next time. it's all a learning curve)

thanks again,
josh

[mudskipper]

It sounds like the hours thing is a problem between client and agent.

But if the client don't want you to work more than n hours a day, then don't. As you're not getting paid any extra for it, then it's no skin off your nose

Good luck!

[malvolio]

@ northernlad,

No accountant yet. I only got first info about the role Mon, thurs interview, the offer fri am & contracts fri pm.. I thought it would be a week or so before start date but client in hurry. I had to put everything in place over the weekend and started monday. Now it's in place & first week went so well, thinking I like contracting and having more control... Would like to not be rushed & ensure for next contract I don't make same mistakes.

Nope, I agree, I don't know IR35 like an accountant, but I think I understand to some extent how they make decisions or the rational they use. Sure there is alot of loopholes and places to be caught out. Do you know if their is service to have agency contract's looked over for legal clauses / unreasonable clauses & ir35?

Have an appt with an accountant 1st feb. They fully booked before then. I had seen links on here for some, might contact 1-2 to see if they have closer appt's & rates..

It's been all rush rush from client, Not sure if ppl got wrong end of stick.. I'm not complaining about my contract or daily rate or lack of o/t pay. I am happy with rate and contract (as much as I understand it). I wondered if any other parity contractors had problems, re-neged certain parts of the contract, could tell me things to look out for, or had any other advice I would very likely have missed or not even thought about.

(for example I got caught out on opt out of agency code of conduct, didn't even know what it was before they ensured I had signed it! I thought it was 40hr opt out!! my mistake. Won't be so quick next time. it's all a learning curve)

thanks again,
josh

Two lessons here:

1. When we suggest you read the guides, READ THE GUIDES. Then you may have a better idea what you're doing.

2. When presented with a legal document to sign, DON'T SIGN IT UNTIL YOU UNDERSTAND IT. Too late now, but as I said earlier, your time to rengotiate is at renewal when you've proved you're worth keeping.

[fraymond]

@ northernlad,

No accountant yet. I only got first info about the role Mon, thurs interview, the offer fri am & contracts fri pm.. I thought it would be a week or so before start date but client in hurry. I had to put everything in place over the weekend and started monday.

Ok, as you asked previous for some constructive advice from experienced contractors, here's mine....

It's never ok to start without a signed contract. Period. And I've never met a client who couldn't delay a day or two once they've offered. You could have pushed back a start date until Wednesday and found a good accountant and had your contract reviewed in that time. (tell the client you are happy to do 2 days offsite "reading" gratis and skilling up if it becomes a contentious point).

Every contract has a honeymoon period, some much longer than others. And then it wears off. But in my experience, school boy errors at the beginning can often linger around and cause that period to come to an end much sooner... often with tragic results.

[MyUserName]

Surely how the agency bills the client (hourly or daily) and how the you bill the agency (hourly or daily) are two different things. Is there a need for them to match?

What you have said about IR35 is not wrong as such but is an incomplete picture. My contract had all the terms you mentioned but QDOS spotted that they had named me in a title heading which could be interpreted by HMRC as an employment style contract and would over rule the other items.

Also, remember that the contract terms are meaningless unless they represent what is actually happening. Having all the IR35 killers in the world will not help if the client tells the HMRC that they treat you as any other employee.

[psychocandy]

Surely how the agency bills the client (hourly or daily) and how the you bill the agency (hourly or daily) are two different things. Is there a need for them to match?

What you have said about IR35 is not wrong as such but is an incomplete picture. My contract had all the terms you mentioned but QDOS spotted that they had named me in a title heading which could be interpreted by HMRC as an employment style contract and would over rule the other items.

Also, remember that the contract terms are meaningless unless they represent what is actually happening. Having all the IR35 killers in the world will not help if the client tells the HMRC that they treat you as any other employee.

Ultimately, I guess agencies contract with client is none of your business but its a bit weird. You work 10 hours, get a day rate, agency coins it with a few more hours...

Oh well, one good thing, at least client wont be trying to screw extra hours out of you on your day rate cos it'll cost them more with the agency. (Actually, I'd quite like to be in that situation!).

Wonder what would happen though if you worked 4 hours only one day? (Yeh I know generally client wouldnt be happy either) In theory, agency would have to pay you day rate still but they'd get 4 hours off client.

That would be funny to see the agents face.....