discussing rates with other contractors

[Wanderer]

Contract from my agency explicitly prohibits me discussing the rate with anyone else!

Yeah, whatever.

This is probably because they don't want the client to find out that they are taking a massive margin.

[jonathanOnshore2010]

I always tell the end client what rate I'm on. As that lets them verify the agent is taking the right commission (which for banks and PSL's is almost always a flat percentage). Once this uncovered a large agency taking almost 30% when it should have been 12%... that caused a lot of problems

[StopTheEarthIwantToGetOff]

Not even my family or close personal friends know how much I earn per day. Mostly because I don't want to explain that £x rate * 260 days is not the same as a salary of the same amount. Also they don't need to know. I've been pushed on it a few times and usually just answer "enough to make me happy".

Wow! You work every single working day of the year?

[StopTheEarthIwantToGetOff]

Personally, as I'm running my own business, I avoid the pub at lunchtime - unless the client is paying.

You sound like bags of fun!

[craig1]

You sound like bags of fun!

Pie and a pint on Friday is part of the unwritten working relationship with the client! Been to some places where you're looked on as if you have herpes if you suggest a pub lunch on a quiet Friday, usually there's a single, chubby, friendless permie manager up the food chain who looks down with contempt on those who don't spend every minute of a day thinking about work.

[Wanderer]

Wow! You work every single working day of the year?

No, he was explaining that if people know you are on £X per day then they will presume that you can multiply this by 260 to get a salary which is a wrong assumption for them to make.

[Stan]

It's not something to discuss freely, however it is worth comparing notes on occasion with people you trust to ensure you aren't actually undercharging or if you want to gain an understanding of the going rate in a sector you are new to. As mentioned you still have to take what is said with a pinch of salt depending on who you are asking. Some people won't discuss it, some will talk in generalities and some will just tell you exact amounts. I find it's more of an etiquette issue than a business issue, after all we have most to gain by knowing if we are competitively priced not the companies we are contracted to.

I've known people who have spent years accepting crappy rates because they'd assumed that's what everyone was on, but never checked.

[bobspud]

No, he was explaining that if people know you are on £X per day then they will presume that you can multiply this by 260 to get a salary which is a wrong assumption for them to make.

Or you could also bill the client for all the work you do and end up with a nice back log of hours that require claiming while you are sat on a beach.

I always get stuck into to the client about rates at the interview stages. It keeps the agent honest, and at that point I have not signed any confidentiality agreements preventing the discussion. I have a offer on the table as of friday, but I think the agent is trying to up his cut.
So my first job on Monday will be to phone the customer to accept the job and while I am at it to ask why he feels the lower offer is justified If I am right, I will be back on the rate I expected by the end of the morning. otherwise I will be satisfied that the end client (a consultancy firm) are as stingy as I had heard they are...

[KentPhilip]

I always get stuck into to the client about rates at the interview stages.

I thought conventional wisdom is don't talk about money at interview, as it makes you look greedy and not interested in the job itself?

[bobspud]

I thought conventional wisdom is don't talk about money at interview, as it makes you look greedy and not interested in the job itself?

No thats just a bag of w*nk dreamed up to make sure you don't go discussing rates in front of the guy that could end up paying as much as 40% more for you...

It doesn't need to be handled to distastefully. Just go along the lines of "So I have bid for this work at XXX rate. I based this on 8 hours a day and no need to work overtime or go traveling halfway across the country... Does this suit your expectations? Obviously i can do the odd hour more but if you expect me to live on site we need adjust the figures to suit both of us..."

does that make me look money grabbing??

I am a contractor. what the hell do you think I am here for? (hint: its not the canteen or your wonderful team environment )