How to deal with pimp games..???

[NotAllThere]

Since candidates do not have direct contact with client

You've had interviews - why do you not have direct contact with client?

[HeadOfTesting]

[QUOTE=...this can give agent opportunity to play games behind the scenes to maximize margin but if they get caught client will be pissed[/QUOTE]

Some will be pissed but many won't care - more often than not the hiring manager has bigger fish to fry.

[Darren_Test]

You've had interviews - why do you not have direct contact with client?

Well..Is it fair to give business card to the interviewer at the end of interview..

My business card just gives Name, email & mobile number no other details. its professionally made & of high quality stuff..

Is it fair to do that..?? I normally give my card only if the other party gives his card..

[ace00]

............
Is it fair to do that..?? I normally give my card only if the other party gives his card..

I wouldn't - refer to previous post by headoftesting.
Direct calling the client = potential troublemaker.

[HeadOfTesting]

I wouldn't - refer to previous post by headoftesting.
Direct calling the client = potential troublemaker.

A business card in the meeting is ok. But I wouldn't make direct contact from home.

[Darren_Test]

A business card in the meeting is ok. But I wouldn't make direct contact from home.

I am not intend to call client directly..(BTW I did that once & got royally screwed. that client haven't considered my CV after my fatefull SMS..you could refer one of my previous posts on that..!!)..But gives option to the client to contact me directly if they decide to ...may be now ..or may be in the future..if a client donot want hassle of agents in the future. Not sure giving business card will do any damage ...

It might be bit unfair to the agency as they removed contact info from CV & submitted to client to avoid any direct client-candidate interaction..thats the only worry..If the client & agency are in really good terms it might look odd if the candidate give business card to client with the intention that client can contact directly if needed...

[Darren_Test]

From what I am hearing agencies are really playing hardball at the moment, trying to maximize margins above and beyond

My rule of thumb, avoid all discussion of rates until position is offered* as before that point you are negotiating from a position of weakness

*Only exception is if advertised role did not even hint at rate and agency does not give a ball park during initial call, then I just ask for rough ballpark quote to make sure we are not wasting each others time. If agency push's to know my rate I always say "it will depend on what the role entails"

Yes..real negotiation needed only if offer is in place..But the fact is that agent only can provide you information on client's offer I..So he can hide/delay that info as long as he wanted and also he can utilise that information cleverly & manipulate for his advantage..!!..

Say even after client nod for a candidate, agent can still pretend by saying "client is still undecided, and requested to see if there is any chance of rate negotiation..??" I am sure if there is a preferred agency he could play lot of dirty games even if there is an offer..It may be dangerous for the agency in a mutli-agency scenario.

Can they...???

[Svalbaard]

Had this happen to me at my current client co.

Agreed rate with agency, attended interview, subsequently offered role through agency on condition that I take a 10% rate cut (as demanded by the client co. apparently).

Luckily, I had the interviewers phone number so I called him direct to query this and found that no demand to reduce rate had been made.

I went back to agency with this information and was after some initial resistance re-offered original rate.

Turns out that the agency had offered me the day rate that had been offered by the company and had forgotten to deduct their margin. Idiots.

Happy to name and shame agency via PM if you are interested.

[Fred Bloggs]

Even recent times..?? where some one else could undercut you..??

If I was in the market now I'd have to reduce my rate because it was agreed 15 months ago at the top of the market but I would make it clear from the very outset what my bottom dollar is. Someone can undercut you in any market at any time.

[Not So Wise]

Yes..real negotiation needed only if offer is in place..But the fact is that agent only can provide you information on client's offer I..So he can hide/delay that info as long as he wanted and also he can utilise that information cleverly & manipulate for his advantage..!!..

Say even after client nod for a candidate, agent can still pretend by saying "client is still undecided, and requested to see if there is any chance of rate negotiation..??" I am sure if there is a preferred agency he could play lot of dirty games even if there is an offer..It may be dangerous for the agency in a mutli-agency scenario.

Can they...???

Yes preferred or sole supplier agencies have better bargaining power, which is why you always try to find out if they are such so you know what you are up against (good way to tell this before you even apply is to see if any other agencys offering role, if they are I never drop my rate)

Basically it's a game of bluffing, agent knows more than you because he knows the clients position, but he does not know how low you are willing to go before you will decide it is not worth it (hence why you NEVER give a direct answer to "What is your lowest rate"). But on flip side, you do know your minimum and need to be willing to walk away if agent is not willing to match your price

Good example, Role was advertised at a certain rate, applied and interviewed for the position. Agency came back offering original rate minus 15%, but after seeing what role entailed I was not to hot on it and was going to walk away, especially as had another offer on the table, but client was eager to hire me.

After much back and forth got 30% more than initial max rate advertised with 2 days a week working from home

On the other hand, another time refused to budge on rate and client/agency withdrew the offer

It basically is like a game of poker, and he who bluffs the best without pushing the others to far wins