Bye Bye to Brolly??

[NotAllThere]

Yeah, I've been overseas for a while. Just trying to get my head around which approach is best to take

Er... back overseas?

[DocP]

Yeah tell me about it

[TykeMerc]

It seems to me that this rule is rather vague. And that there is little you can do to protect yourself against it.

That's very much understating the case. To be honest not even HMRC actually understand IR35 hence they lose almost every IR35 case that comes to court.
Mal has the figures on IR35 cases won/lost.

[malvolio]

Last time I looked, 1472 wins, 6 losses...

[PinkPoshRat]

ok, so I'm new here, but... wtf is tulip?

[ASB]

Last time I looked, 1472 wins, 6 losses...

There is a certain amount of spin there.....

Of the 1472 how many of those were actually contested by the revenue. i.e. to be absolutely plain of the 1,472 "victories" how many of these were decided by the special commissionerers, the general commissioners or beyond.

I do agree that there is an obvious pattern though. Where somebody has had working practices believed to be outsaide IR35 then the vast majority of these cases are in fact conceded by HMRC as a result of the advisers input.

Further you do not state how many (if any) cases that the underlying insurers have recommended the taxpayer concedes. It could be 1, it could be 10,000. Of course the organisation you represent is not in any way accountable to me, as I am not longer a member, but the figures you tout to suggest there is a 99% chance of being found outside are misleading. They do not say that at all.

[malvolio]

The numbers are as provided by PCG's insurers. As far as I understand them, these are cases that they have represented at some point in one of the relevant appeals processes. So 1472 (or whatever) are cases that have started and been closed without IR35 being found applicable, bearing in mind that quite a lot of them were closed off by a letter saying HMRC weren't going to take the inquiry any further. At which precise point in the process is totally irrelevant, HMRC's case was not proven.

And for way it's worth, QDOS have their own numbers, running at roughly the same ratio (in fact rather better, since AFAIK they haven't had a loss fpr some time).

So basically I believe the numbers say precisely what they appear to say: almost all IR35 cases are without merit.

[RichardCranium]

ok, so I'm new here, but... wtf is tulip?

Newbies!

You are too young to know.

[PinkPoshRat]

If you don't tell me, I'll sulk

[NotAllThere]

Type in all the rude words you know and you'll find out.