Rate negotiation question

[portseven]

So I am in a strange contract, it was a 12 month fixed term contract. Pay-wise I was given an annual salary (55k), I get permy stuff like sick and holiday pay and 3 months notice. Though I sign timesheets and the arrangment regards the agency they have worked out a day rate for me (about 212). I thought it was a nice route back into contracting from a permy role I was in.

I have now been extended till Jan 08, and said they want me for at least until Aug 08 next year, they are pleased with me and I have been told so various times, there was a big mess to tidy up from previous person in the roll.

The other day they asked if I want a 'proper' permy role, I said no as I said to them I know I can get £450 - £500 a day on the contract market with my skills (enterprise architect).

A day later I was approached and told that they understood my decision, but would I still be OK till August, given that I have identified some major work that needs to happen next year that needs a large architecture input. And that they suggest when I sit down with the IT director I ask for a rate increase as I should get it.

So my question is what shall I ask for. I am thinking of asking to be changed to a 'proper' contract, so no permy stuff like the 3 month notice and sick and holiday pay, in return of a day rate of £400 - £450. What is in the back of my mind is that I am being cheeky in asking for effectively a double in rate as well as the fact that I know that the pimp will want a cut, so that will eat into my rate.

Anyway, what does the collective wisdom of CUK say?

[rootsnall]

fixed term contract - a bit of swear word meaning low paid contract. It's OK if you are learning something new I suppose ?

Are you confident you can get 450-500 elsewhere ? If so then why are you working for less than half the going rate ? No wonder they are praising you a lot. If you don't want the permie job then ask for the going rate and be prepared to walk if you aren't happy with what is put on the table. Don't be soft !

[ookook]

At my place theres a mix of guys who were taken on as "straight" contrators on £400 plus a day and guys who were talked into taking a "permy thru the agency" type role. Yes they get sick pay, minimal holidays etc and in return get a salary of about £45K. To the end client theres absolutely no difference in the money they pay the agency for permy or contract worker. The only real benefit is to the agency who cream off a huge margin on the permy workers.

As a side note - as the project has reduced in size the majority of the permy workers have been canned, so it doesnt afford any extra protection.

If I were you I'd jump straight back to a proper rate and act like a proper contractor - I can't see any real benefit to these "permy thru agency" arrangements.

[oracleslave]

fixed term contract - a bit of swear word meaning low paid contract. It's OK if you are learning something new I suppose ?

Are you confident you can get 450-500 elsewhere ? If so then why are you working for less than half the going rate ? No wonder they are praising you a lot. If you don't want the permie job then ask for the going rate and be prepared to walk if you aren't happy with what is put on the table. Don't be soft !

I agree with rootsnall really. They have got you in long-term to mitigate their risk at a low rate and you are in a comfort zone thinking 3 months notice blah blah. If you are going to treat this as a contract then do it properly and charge the going rate. There is no loyalty and the concept of a "permanent job" is a misnomer!

[MarillionFan]

How come your agent isnt negotiating for you!!!

[portseven]

You are all bloody right, though I will say its been a good learning experience this job so I am not complaining too much. I have done some good stuff that will look good on the CV, PCI Compliance, HHT implmentation and some good technical strategy planning.

I will ask for a decent rate or I am off elsewhere.

[miffy]

Go for the rate your worth mate.

Otherwise thank them but I'd tell them where to poke it. Stay till Aug... of course... but ONLY for the market rate.

As the other poster says... don't be soft. Someone is pocketing the extra money that should be in your bank account.

[TheFaQQer]

Go for the rate your worth mate.

Otherwise thank them but I'd tell them where to poke it. Stay till Aug... of course... but ONLY for the market rate.

As the other poster says... don't be soft. Someone is pocketing the extra money that should be in your bank account.

Good advice, but you're

[miffy]

Bummer.

I was hoping nobody would spot that... welcome back anyway... how was the week inside? (or should that be "outside")

Did you have ordinary porridge, ready brek or oatso simple?

[malvolio]

Rule of thumb - £55k plus package as a freelance is £55 an hour for 260 days a year. Call it £450 a day just to stand still in terms of net take-home. OTOH, one year's job security. What's that worth?

I'd go back to a proper contract myself, and pitch for £500 as a realistic rate rise.