Experiences with Accenture

[TheDude]

I started my career at Logica and I was amazed when I found out how much I was being charged out at with zero commercial experience...

[lecyclist]

Currently working for my 29th distinct client in a contracting career that began when I was 22, I've worked either directly or indirectly for Cap Gemini, IBM, PWC, Logica, Accenture, CSC, Fujitsu, IBM, HCL, EDS.

It's interesting from a behavioural manipulation viewpoint, the punishment hierarchy that is an integral part of the recruitment and promotion model for all these companies. The treatment I've observed some years previously at HCL (on 2 occasions) of their own Indian staff, operating under restrictive visas in the EU, has probably been the most abusive of them all, but the other consultancies inhabit the same spectrum.

To state the obvious, there is not enough capacity at junior partner level for all the graduates who are recruited annually, and an abusive, attrititional relationship model weeds out all individuals who deviate from the optimal corporate norm. There is an astute logic to this process, identifying the sweet spot for career progression, beyond which the billable rate of the employee minus the salary paid multiplied by the appetite for the employee to absorb endless abuse, begins to decline. Hence the halcyon years of billing £1200 pd for an ambitious unattached junior consultant with 2 years experience fades once she is burnt out and questions whether her quality of life merits such exploitation. The attrition pyramid demands that she be recycled by a fresh resource.

For those staff who survive this process, and later in their careers are deemed to be deviants, as a partner at Logic once explained to me, there are numerous internal processes to address this scenario. A favourite he used -- he "loved" using -- was to go through every expense receipt the consultant had logged during their career (spanning many years), find an inevitable set of anomalies, then apply pressure for the consultant to be terminated or forced to resign based on some honesty clause in the employment contract.

That's capitalism baby!

[TheDude]

For those staff who survive this process, and later in their careers are deemed to be deviants, as a partner at Logic once explained to me, there are numerous internal processes to address this scenario. A favourite he used -- he "loved" using -- was to go through every expense receipt the consultant had logged during their career (spanning many years), find an inevitable set of anomalies, then apply pressure for the consultant to be terminated or forced to resign based on some honesty clause in the employment contract.

That's capitalism baby!

The banks don't even bother with that. In technology hardly anyone makes MD and there comes a point in everyones career where they are deemed too expensive compared to the constant flux of cheaper younger people into the firm. Whenever it is time to reduce headcount VPs in their late 30s/early 40's are the prime target.

It is quite sad seeing the look on the faces of people who devoted their lives to a firm and thought they were part of the inner circle getting stabbed in the back by colleagues they thought were friends.

Fortunately banks are quite happy to use contractors in their 40s and 50s so there is a way to sidestep this blatant age discrimination.

[PerfectStorm]

See this thread, the same answers apply to Accenture. https://forums.contractoruk.com/busi...onsulting.html

[Paralytic]

For those staff who survive this process, and later in their careers are deemed to be deviants, as a partner at Logic once explained to me, there are numerous internal processes to address this scenario. A favourite he used -- he "loved" using -- was to go through every expense receipt the consultant had logged during their career (spanning many years), find an inevitable set of anomalies, then apply pressure for the consultant to be terminated or forced to resign based on some honesty clause in the employment contract.

That's capitalism baby!

This is so true. I once spent some time in a Professional Services arm (their consulting team) of a large American software company and their senior VP often said/joked that he could get rid of any consultant just by getting someone to review their past expense receipts as they'd always be able to find at least one mistake (probably genuine) they could nail to the mast (does anyone even use that phrase any more?)

As you suggest, that alone would not be enough to dismiss someone, but the threat of putting them on the disciplinary path (managed exit) and how that would look on their CV, would lead to people making their "own choice to leave". I never actually saw it happen, but the threat was real.

[GigiBronz]

The banks don't even bother with that. In technology hardly anyone makes MD and there comes a point in everyones career where they are deemed too expensive compared to the constant flux of cheaper younger people into the firm. Whenever it is time to reduce headcount VPs in their late 30s/early 40's are the prime target.

It is quite sad seeing the look on the faces of people who devoted their lives to a firm and thought they were part of the inner circle getting stabbed in the back by colleagues they thought were friends.

Fortunately banks are quite happy to use contractors in their 40s and 50s so there is a way to sidestep this blatant age discrimination.

Yeap, this comes so close to home. Wanted to replay to your other post as well.

The games seems to be so diabolical that it barely has anything to do with the quality of your work. It’l all optics and politics.

it’s as if they’ve invented the perfect sociopatic game to distroy the human spirit. Some kind of prison for the educated.

prison is a state of mind in the end…

anyway, had recently had a similar experience, I might post for fun in general but usually I get the odd remarks and the ‘go back where you came from’ from BR14. For being an ungrateful immigrant willing to do the tulipty jobs.

started even to think at some point that there are gov shills manning this forum.

anyway.

clown world.

coming back to the subject, a lot of times it’s about perspective. A tulipty role might not be that bad if you know why you are doing it. But without the right motivation and feeling trapped in a deadend role, I think it creates long term emotional damage. You should quit as soon as you feel like that.

[IsayIsayIsay]

Brother in Law made MD at Goldman. Just learned he's had a heart attack previously (he wasn't aware) and it had manifested itself through stress, mental health and general lack of motivation. Long hours, a bottle or two of (expensive) red wine a night, big house, golf and wonderful holidays.

He's now looking at retiring at 47, ruined health and on medication for the rest of his life... everything has its cost.

[lecyclist]

started even to think at some point that there are gov shills manning this forum.

GigiBronz, just takes a small number of self important content contributors to kill a forum. IMO contracting continues to be an aspirational lifestyle that provides talented working class people (in particular) access to mobile financially lucrative opportunities that can be transformational. That attitude is underrepresented and under-promoted on these boards, largely because happy busy people have no inclination to post.

[GigiBronz]

IMO contracting continues to be an aspirational lifestyle that provides talented working class people (in particular) access to mobile financially lucrative opportunities that can be transformational.

This sounds like what a patronising Bezos might say to his employees while at the same time him not following none of the rules of the construct.

I don't think that particularly talented people are usually found in contracting. Just more business savy people that understand how the world works and can sell themselves well and also deliver to expectations. To some extent.

It is a more honest way of approaching 'selling your time. The alternative is the mainstream, perm construct that is full of delusion.

I think, the best we could do is follow the truth and be honest of expressing it. Anyone that has survived through a few contracts and been through the corporate route would have at least some scepticism about how the system works.

That is the part as well that I have found to be lacking around here. A lot of people being still deluded by glittery lights and playing around to the beautiful ideas that keeps other people trapped in the wage lifestyle.

I believe, above all should be a place of honesty. Rest follows.

[TheDude]

This sounds like what a patronising Bezos might say to his employees while at the same time him not following none of the rules of the construct.

I don't think that particularly talented people are usually found in contracting. Just more business savy people that understand how the world works and can sell themselves well and also deliver to expectations. To some extent.

It is a more honest way of approaching 'selling your time. The alternative is the mainstream, perm construct that is full of delusion.

I think, the best we could do is follow the truth and be honest of expressing it. Anyone that has survived through a few contracts and been through the corporate route would have at least some scepticism about how the system works.

That is the part as well that I have found to be lacking around here. A lot of people being still deluded by glittery lights and playing around to the beautiful ideas that keeps other people trapped in the wage lifestyle.

I believe, above all should be a place of honesty. Rest follows.

I agree - it's not uncommon for contractors to view the difference between perm salaries and contract day rates as evidence of their own superior ability.

As a perm I worked with many mediocre contractors who were a lot more interested in letting people know about their pilots licence or sports car than in demonstrating how technically skilled they were. These were typically the guys that fought to keep every penny they could away from HMRC as well.