State of the Market

[NowPermOutsideUK]

I recently had a call from an agent about an HR systems role 'perfect for me' (my background is finance and procurement apps) at £39k, FTC one year. I told her that I'm in a contract just now so not currently looking, but for that type of role and skill level her client should be ashamed of themselves for trying to take advantage.

According to her, it's not the fault of the clients who are offering pitiful rates 'it's actually the contractors who are driving down rates. A lot of them are so desperate they'll work for anything at the moment'. Her words, not mine.

Btw, I'm aware of the concept of supply and demand. I'm also aware that a lot of people have no choice but to take a cr*ppy rate at the moment but still.

So there you have it. It's all our fault.

very interesting - Wouldnt believe anything the agency says but who knows

Im astonished 39K is mentioned I really am - Dont tell me your day rate was also 600ish

If this is the new norm god help us all

[rocktronAMP]

I still don’t understand how people put up with it. A lot of them struggle with anxiety and mental health issue while working a job that doesn’t bring them any satisfaction, they barely afford the rent in a dump humid place and their idea of good food is an overpriced meal at the local pub.
They’ll never afford to live where they work and they rack up debt every day to buy things they don’t need or go on holidays they barely enjoy.
Only to fill the gap in their soul that gives them the impression that their life is going somewhere.
A lot of them although highly educated on paper are functiong idiots.
If you work on 70k in central London, put 10h per day, be stressed out evey day and only manage to save 6k/year. Is it really worth it?

Are you then predicting a London "Los Grande Exitos" ?

The trouble with megacities though, is as soon as somebody leaves the big smoke, then immediately another dreamer and aspiring tech person will fill up the vacated space. My question is where do the smart "leavers" go? Which town and/or village do they head off to?

I agree with you on the £70K base thing and the high cost of living in London. Probably, a lot of people are reconsidering their options, post covid 19. IMHO, the London hey day was between 2002 and 2008, between the Internet dotcom bomb and then a few months just before Lehman Brothers weekend disappearence. (For those who don't know the context. Lehman Brothers was an investment bank in Canary Wharf. One Friday morning everything was hunky dory and over course of just a weekend, the very next Monday, it had gone. At the time, I had a friend of mine was working at Lehmans and there was no compensation, no redundancy and just collect your box and drop off your security pass. He left the country and took up a job in the middle Europe circa 2010, a very prescient dude.)

[jayn200]

So much bulltulip in this post.

A couple of things:

- in normal times, sitting out for a year might be an option because you know there would be contracts to come back to. Put ir35, covid, brexit in the mix and you'll see the number of contracts you'll be able to come back to in 2021/2022 will not be as many so your 1 year off might well become 18-24 months, and THEN you'll have to take a 40k permie job if you're lucky to find one given your big employment gap.

- "holiday on the cheap"? what does that even mean? Are you going on holiday alone? Can your partner take that much time off? Don't you have a social life/social commitments? You just take and leave? Bulltulip

Employment gaps are myths. No one cares especially when you used that time to learn a new programming language or tech skill and picked up 3-6 relevant industry/vendor certs.

I have reskilled multiple times with the changing technologies and into different areas. I've taken time off to do it sometimes and no one cares.

I'd rather work at tesco then take a programming job for 40k a year.

[NowPermOutsideUK]

The good years we’re up until 2016 but what you said about Lehman is exactly correct.

And also about someone else coming to fill the space of the one who left. Couldn’t have said it better myself

[cwah]

Employment gaps are myths. No one cares especially when you used that time to learn a new programming language or tech skill and picked up 3-6 relevant industry/vendor certs.

I have reskilled multiple times with the changing technologies and into different areas. I've taken time off to do it sometimes and no one cares.

I'd rather work at tesco then take a programming job for 40k a year.

If you worked at tesco (as store staff) you wouldn't get £40k/year but half of that... so still better to be programmer

[The Bona Fide]

If you worked at tesco (as store staff) you wouldn't get £40k/year but half of that... so still better to be programmer

Yes but with a Tesco job you can turn up and just go onto autopilot. No daily scrums, meetings, team builds, performance reviews etc to contend with.

[jayn200]

Yes but with a Tesco job you can turn up and just go onto autopilot. No daily scrums, meetings, team builds, performance reviews etc to contend with.

Exactly. Just like I wouldn't be ceo of google for 60k, I wouldn't be a programmer for 40k.

[ladymuck]

Employment gaps are myths. No one cares especially when you used that time to learn a new programming language or tech skill and picked up 3-6 relevant industry/vendor certs.

I have reskilled multiple times with the changing technologies and into different areas. I've taken time off to do it sometimes and no one cares.

I'd rather work at tesco then take a programming job for 40k a year.

Agree gaps are no issue at all. Depending on where you're working you may need a reference to confirm you weren't residing at Her Majesty's leisure but that's no issue to sort out.

[_V_]

Agree gaps are no issue at all. Depending on where you're working you may need a reference to confirm you weren't residing at Her Majesty's leisure but that's no issue to sort out.

The only time it has been an issue for me is with agents. Where was you working between date X and Y? You weren't working, okay client won't like that so will not forward your CV.

I'm sure client would be fine with it, but with agents it seems their no.1 reason for rejection.

[ladymuck]

The only time it has been an issue for me is with agents. Where was you working between date X and Y? You weren't working, okay client won't like that so will not forward your CV.

I'm sure client would be fine with it, but with agents it seems their no.1 reason for rejection.

Have to say, I've not had that experience.