Advice needed on breaking into Contracting (in Finance)

[Draco]

I thought someone might bring this up. It might help to know my previous employer was a bank largely owned by the taxpayer. So they used this as a reason not to promote or better remunerate me. My salary did not budge in all the time I was there, but they were very happy to pile more and more expectations on you. I absolutely showed value there (as demonstrated by the fact that they immediately offered a 10% increase upon my resignation - still too little though) and am quite confident I can add value in a contracting capacity too. That job (and others before it) showed that the performance fiasco one has to go through as a permie really is meaningless. If you use that to justify any request for an increase, they still ignore it if it doesn't back up their point of view. I know what you're thinking... well the bank was in dire straits after all! My answer to that is: stop moving staff from one building to the next every few months (at a rumoured cost of £500 per head every time it happens) and instead use that cash to pay better wages!

The 10% increase is merely the cost of having to find another person to keep the role filled. The role clearly is the valuable thing, not the person filling it. And that could go to Vice President level. We are only cogs in the big machine, and if you're to be hired as a contractor at a market rate, you really have to show yourself to be the right and irreplaceable cog to every single client. Slightly off? No answer.

Truly showing value requires mastery. Not many can achieve that - and it's not just the technical side, it's also the social side - whether you're paid by your Ltd or by client's Ltd.

What's the best way to deal with agents in your view? I suspect that around 70% of my calls to agents go nowhere. The jobs online are bogus or the agent has no intention of putting me forward but still tries to get info out of me.

Then we're on the same page. I haven't mastered that very well myself. I never call agents, they always call me - I've marketed myself enough that the last three contracts I had were all incoming. Already changes the power dynamic. Read this one book on "power" and see where you're making mistakes - we all are.

Get them to give you info about the role, ask as many important questions as you can. If agent doesn't want to give solid info, it's fake, tell him you've to go back to a meeting, a lecture or drive to pick up your sister from work, and to send you a JD.

Yes. And also to avoid the BS one has to put up with as a permie.

I somehow think it's an illusion. We just have a different type of BS.

Everyone's suggestions here to go back to permanent would not only apply to you but also to some contractors on the market. I keep passing interviews, getting offers, which turn out to be something different from what I expected with funny amounts of bureaucracy.

[pr1]

Thats how most of us started on here...

you can have an "i was brave" sticker too then

[joy division]

Just received yet another mail from an agent, saying the role I recently applied for is going on hold. All too familiar story...Another one bites the dust.

[Milkyway]

@OP: I wish you luck with finding a contract these days, especially when we are getting too close to the "holidays in a few weeks time" mood.
I think there won't be any new good news about the market from now until sometime mid-February.

Even after you manage to cross the getting the contract step, you will need to think about the next important step - i.e. contract / working conditions review with QDOS et al.
The contract can fail there, and any attempted negotiations can make it harder to get the client/agent to budge for any terms to be changed, thereby losing that potential contract, since they will say they can get cheaper / foreign material (well,import labour, that is) that can accept a contract without arguing on the contract terms to be changed.

I sometimes wonder why people generally think Contracting is better than the Permie-dom world.
We have different kind of BS indeed, like one other poster said here.

Also with too much of cheap import labour and too many foreign consultancies operating in the UK, the contracting landscape has changed!

Good luck!

[gables]

you can have an "i was brave" sticker too then

Can I have one too

[northernladuk]

I have a background in software development and within the last few years moved solely into Business Analysis and Project Management, a move that made sense because I found that much of the more mainstream development work (such as what I was doing) was being outsourced.

I really can't see why this thread has gone on so long when the root of your problem is in the first sentence.And just to put the final nail in the coffin

I am positioning myself as a Senior BA, but I do have a formal PM qualification too and have PM'ed projects. My CV highlights the BA experience though, as this is where I want to move.

Markymark seems to be the only person that's summed this up properly so far. You have fat chance of getting sod all with that history, particularly in finance. Positioning yourself as a Senior BA? You are or you aren't. You don't position yourself in contracting. You sell the skills you've got because you are the best available and you can provide experience and skills the client needs. Those lines tell me you can't. A 'dabbler' just does not work in contracting, you've had a pop at some stuff and that's it. You are a generalist with no particular skills or history so have nothing to offer the client that want's years of solid experience proving you can deliver. IMO the very worst person you can take on for a PM role (for example) is someone that has 'PM'd' projects. Good PM's are very difficult to find. Anyone can follow a bit of process and blindy run through a good project. A good PM can do it consistently and deal with any and all issues based on experience. Again, you cannot.

I am very surprised you get so many interviews to be honest. You will be falling down because you probably can't do the 'expert' speak and won't be demonstrating the breadth of experience required. You just won't be highlighting points that experience PM's or BA's know are important because you've not done them. You will be giving a text book interview, not an experts one.

Jack of all and master of none will just not cut it in contracting, particularly in a shrinking FS market.

Until recently I was applying for roles upwards of £500 pd. I lowered since that to £450. I suppose, given I am new to this, rate is something that should be compromised on. Going any lower though, will make it uneconomical.

As economical as sitting on the bench with your thumb up your bum. This is just ridiculous. At best the only option available to you is to take a lower rate to get the experience and a foot in the door yet you won't consider it.

I absolutely showed value there (as demonstrated by the fact that they immediately offered a 10% increase upon my resignation - still too little though)

This is always the case, it will cost that much more to replace you so it's a quick win. It has very little to do with the effort you have put in.

Hmm, not sure about being newbie contractor should be a problem, let's face it most of us were permie first, I started contracting after just 4 years permie - but then had a very in demand skillset and the supply was low

Being a newbie is always a problem. You bring a whole host of new risks to the client and may still have a working ethic the client doesn't want. He wants a contractor that can deliver hard and understand they are the customer. You work for cash. They don't want an ex permie who things he's going to work for another employer and will expect flexibility and an easy time.

Oddly enough many people says the second gig is the hardest to get but it's definitely a little more stacked against you as a newbie.. which brings me on to another point the OP needs to consider...

So he waits and waits for his dream gig and somehow secures one for 3 months.... What does he think is going to happen while trying to get gig 2. If he's nothing saleable to client for gig one he's only going to have a little more for gig 2. I think the OP has to make a very tough decision here and go back permie and become a specialist in something and then come back to contracting.

[MrMarkyMark]

Clients usually prefer contractors to be experienced, rather than qualified. This is what I think you are actually lacking.

I have worked for 5 IBs, 6 consultancies and a number of other blue chip clients.
Unfortunately, as far as we know, at this stage, you just have one bank on there, relevant to the skill you are "selling".

This will put you at a disadvantage when pitching against other contractors with the same qualifications, but a lot more experience.

Yes, you could try decreasing your rate to negate this, but I wouldn't be pitching an IB for less that £400 PD, even given your lack of experience.

[LondonManc]

Unfortunately for the OP, I agree with NLUK. Patience is required to get the experience that you'd need to secure the roles.

Prove yourself for 3 years as a perm Senior BA, move into financial teams in non-FS sector and then look at IB. I've got 20 years in BI (this year!) and went contracting after 14 years of permdom. At that point I felt confident enough because other people were referring to me as the expert (a term I particularly hate).

Good luck - don't try to master chapter 15 if you've not worked through the first 14 chapters first.

[joy division]

Clients usually prefer contractors to be experienced, rather than qualified. This is what I think you are actually lacking.

I have worked for 5 IBs, 6 consultancies and a number of other blue chip clients.
Unfortunately, as far as we know, at this stage, you just have one bank on there, relevant to the skill you are "selling".

This will put you at a disadvantage when pitching against other contractors with the same qualifications, but a lot more experience.

Yes, you could try decreasing your rate to negate this, but I wouldn't be pitching an IB for less that £400 PD, even given your lack of experience.

I do have the experience.

In the last 10 years I have worked in two Tier 1 IBs and one major hedge fund. That is experience enough. I am not junior and I am not a newbie in anything other than contracting. True, that I have not taken on the role of project management for very long, however my BA experience is solid. I am not going for PM roles. However the fact that I have the PM qualification does seem to be desirable. And, coming from a tech background I feel makes it more so as inevitably in FS we are working on software projects.

Just how much experience is needed before one jumps into contracting???

And BTW, I had a good career in various other industries (including media and telecommunications before moving into Finance.

[MrMarkyMark]

In the last 10 years I have worked in two Tier 1 IBs and one major hedge fund. That is experience enough.

Errrr....obviously not...otherwise you would have secured a role after 11 interviews?
Maybe, it is deemed not relevant or current enough?