The big day is here

[meridian]

What _are_ you quibbling about? That's exactly what I implied originally.

Either your implication was too vague, or was made deliberately so by your unnecessary antagonism about who brought the case that helped to secure your democracy. Or perhaps I'm a bit tired, it's been a long week already.

I wasn't suggesting this Gina Miller personally drafted and approved the Article 50 act. (God, and they say Brexiters are stupid!)

Without the legal challenge, the Government would have been free to invoke Article 50 by an order in council or similar, which is what they wanted, and thus be able to change or revoke it now at the drop of a hat in the same way.

But, in view of the legal challenge, well see my above post relating to Acts of Parliament.

No quibble here.

[OwlHoot]

Because there is a non-trivial likelihood we night get a 2nd referendum for one thing.

Well who knows, but TM has repeatedly ruled it out, and this week so also did Steptoe.

So it seems rather unlikely, because after all both these party leaders must give some consideration to avoiding a step that will cause their voter support to implode

[Whorty]

Well who knows, but TM has repeatedly ruled it out, and this week so also did Steptoe.

So it seems rather unlikely, because after all both these party leaders must give some consideration to avoiding a step that will cause their voter support to implode

As a remainer (yes, really) and as a realist I think the pragmatic course is for MPs of all sides to get together and work on a deal that parliament can support. Something that should have happened 2.5 years ago, but the Tories were too arrogant to do. Maybe now there is a chance of this and we can kick the chaos brexiters into the long grass and get a Brexit that, whilst not better than what we have today, does at least work. Norway seems the obvious way forward and no one can deny this is against the ref as Norway is not in the EU hence we will have left.

We do not want a 2nd ref as there is no set of questions that will please the great unwashed. As a Remainer I'd want a 2nd ref to be between May's Deal vs Remain, but Leavers will want the question to be May's Deal vs No Deal. Pretty sure in both circumstances May's Deal will lose! So the question will be loaded even before its asked.

We don't need a GE as it's unlikely that we will get a majority government. Just imagine if these clown Tories get in again with a minority government? FFS, doesn't bare thinking about. I'd rather have a Corbyn government than another Tory pile of self serving idiots in charge of Brexit.

Anyway, all out of our hands. Tonight I'll be doing a bike race, followed by a big bowl of popcorn to watch the fun unfold

[stonehenge]

We don't need a GE as it's unlikely that we will get a majority government. Just imagine if these clown Tories get in again with a minority government? FFS, doesn't bare thinking about. I'd rather have a Corbyn government than another Tory pile of self serving idiots in charge of Brexit.

If there was a GE, I reckon the Tories would get fewer seats than last time, so even the DUP wouldn't be able to prop them up. No other party would enter a coalition with them (the LibDems learned that lesson the hard way).

I couldn't see Labour getting an overall majority because Corbyn is too toxic.

Maybe Labour would get the most seats, but they'd have to form a coalition with the LibDems and/or SNP. But I don't know how that would work when both of those parties are adamantly anti-brexit.

A GE sounds like a recipe for more chaos to me.

[jamesbrown]

Norway seems the obvious way forward and no one can deny this is against the ref as Norway is not in the EU hence we will have left.

To quote a well known "chaos brexiter" from the HoC debate today.

There are members who are prepared to consider for example going for a Norway-style option, which I have to say seems to me to be an example of the elites picking up the carpet and brushing the broken glass under it to try to avoid the difficulties that have been created. -- Dominic Grieve

Here's a non-triggering fluffy unicorn link that you can trust:

Grieve: It says it all the PM is relying on a criminal lawyer to sell Brexit | Latest Brexit news and top stories - The New European

[jamesbrown]

Only one of four amendments pushed to vote. Labour and SNP both drop their amendments for clean KO, now expected around 19:30.

[DimPrawn]

Anyway, all out of our hands. Tonight I'll be doing a bike race, followed by a big bowl of popcorn to watch the fun unfold

Watch out for irresponsible bus drivers....

[meridian]

Posted at 19:04
MPs vote on amendment giving UK right to terminate backstop
EU Withdrawal Agreement Debate

House of Commons
Parliament
Conservative MP John Baron has moved his amendment (amendment f) which gives the UK the right to terminate the Northern Ireland backstop without the agreement of the EU.

It is backed by cross-party group of Brexiteers, including 12 Conservatives, one independent and one DUP MP.

MPs have divided to vote on this amendment.

Posted at 19:23
BREAKING
Tory MP's amendment defeated

House of Commons
Parliament
Tory MP John Baron's amendment (amendment f) is defeated by a majority of 576.

The votes for the amendment were 24 for and 600 against.

Now MPs move on to the main vote, on the government's motion.

That’s time well spent, then

[DimPrawn]

Govt loses Brexit vote.

[meridian]

Lol, it’s all coming in now. Corbyn’s finally got off his arse to table a no confidence motion, plus a bit of advice from Tusk:

Donald Tusk on Twitter: "If a deal is impossible, and no one wants no deal, then who will finally have the courage to say what the only positive solution is?"