NI and other UK borders

[vetran]

It's one of the least real problems in this country.

Real problem is lack of education and lack of desire to fix it.

Strange there is a massive desire to fix it, however there is insufficient resources - can't imagine why our government services should be able to cope with 15 - 20% increase in demand over a decade.

So hard border outside Ireland then, simples. Ah wait, it's not because fruitcakes from DUP won't stand for it

As I said multiple factions, many are nutters.

[AtW]

Strange there is a massive desire to fix it, however there is insufficient resources - can't imagine why our government services should be able to cope with 15 - 20% increase in demand over a decade.

[WTFH]

Sorry was just trying to educate you as you missed the salient point. There was not a wish in the UK to have a hard border but to achieve that we need all sides to cooperate.

No, you missed the point, or to be more precise, you avoided the point.

Vote leave said "Take back control of our borders"
Brexit says "We'll have a new border in Ireland, not as soft as it is today, cause there will be checks, but the checks will only be for 20% of the cross border traffic."

So, it's going from 0% to 20% and that's supposed to be no change?

[sal]

Sorry was just trying to educate you as you missed the salient point. There was not a wish in the UK to have a hard border but to achieve that we need all sides to cooperate.

Just because our incompetent government is happy waving lorries through Dover not collecting tariffs and taxes, doesn't mean the EU is happy to do the same by having a soft border.

Regarding the so called "hi-tech" solution similar to Norway/Sweden's, officials from these countries commented that it's not really suitable for Ireland, due to the nature and volume of the traffic, being completely different.

At it doesn't offer any solution to restriction of the freedom of movement, so coveted by Brexiteers.

The whole topic is just a condensed essence of Brexit - UK is making only demands, without providing practical solutions.

[The_Equalizer]

So hard border outside Ireland then, simples. Ah wait, it's not because fruitcakes from DUP won't stand for it

Limited understanding of a very complex problem. For Unionist their entire identity is tied up with being part of a United Kingdom. Any threat to that, such as aligning Northern Ireland with the EU in such a fashion, is understandably a non-starter.

[The_Equalizer]

Just because our incompetent government is happy waving lorries through Dover not collecting tariffs and taxes, doesn't mean the EU is happy to do the same by having a soft border.

Regarding the so called "hi-tech" solution similar to Norway/Sweden's, officials from these countries commented that it's not really suitable for Ireland, due to the nature and volume of the traffic, being completely different.

At it doesn't offer any solution to restriction of the freedom of movement, so coveted by Brexiteers.

The whole topic is just a condensed essence of Brexit - UK is making only demands, without providing practical solutions.

Essence of Brexit or not, it has quite simply become the EU and Ireland's problem too, and therefore they need to contribute to the solution. The routes north and south aren't that difference to Norway/Sweden despite the numerous comical quotes about the number of crossing points on the Irish border. The majority of heavy traffic uses only a handful of routes, an example being the A1 (from the Northern Irish side). To suggest articulated lorries would suddenly be crossing through Kilcurry and the like is laughable.

I suspect, despite the noise from some of the usual quarters, they are really rubbing their hands in glee with the opportunities smuggling would offer. I'd also offer a large wager that the top brass in Sinn Fein would love a hard border to then push for a border poll.

[sal]

Essence of Brexit or not, it has quite simply become the EU and Ireland's problem too, and therefore they need to contribute to the solution. The routes north and south aren't that difference to Norway/Sweden despite the numerous comical quotes about the number of crossing points on the Irish border. The majority of heavy traffic uses only a handful of routes, an example being the A1 (from the Northern Irish side). To suggest articulated lorries would suddenly be crossing through Kilcurry and the like is laughable.

I suspect, despite the noise from some of the usual quarters, they are really rubbing their hands in glee with the opportunities smuggling would offer. I'd also offer a large wager that the top brass in Sinn Fein would love a hard border to then push for a border poll.

But the EU is proposing solutions - like retain CU membership and some form of freedom of movement of people, or alternatively shift the border between the islands, where it's much less noticeable and easy to enforce. So far the UK gov has rejected both, since DUP has them by the balls.

It's time to face reality, that quitting the CU and getting a host of "lucrative" trade agreements independent from the EU is just a fairy tale. Anyone still believing in it, has a complete lack of common sense and even less understanding of international trade.

The whole Brexit debacle stems from a single issue - every government in the past decades has had 0% interest in doing what's best for the country and 100% of what's required to get them re-elected. A downward spiral of running down the country, that culminated with the Brexit referendum. And now the Tories have managed to shoehorn themselves into an impossibility - any kind of Brexit will cause at least short term harm to the economy, losing them the elections. Cancelling Brexit altogether will anger a lot of Brexit supporters and most likely lose them the elections. Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

The only question now us, how to f**k the country just enough to set the next Labour government to fail, so they can win the following election. It all has nothing to do with the "will of the people" or what's best for Britain, it's all about what's best least worse for the Tory party.

[unixman]

It's going to be Checkpoint Charlie. With added balrogs.

https://services.parliament.uk/bills...rsecurity.html

Bill proposing mile-wide stop and search zone along Northern Ireland border causes outcry

Actually for any border, not just NI...

[WTFH]

I'd also offer a large wager that the top brass in Sinn Fein would love a hard border to then push for a border poll.

I suspect you are right. Having a hard border would get more support for SF from nationalists, and would get more "enthusiastic" support from certain quarters.
Could it lead to a border poll? Possibly.
What would the result of the poll be? Well, I think that could be interesting. There might be quite a few "Unionists" who look at what the UK Gov have done and decide that they would rather be in Ireland/Europe. But could RoI afford to take on NI? Is it a sensible proposition?

[The_Equalizer]

But the EU is proposing solutions - like retain CU membership and some form of freedom of movement of people, or alternatively shift the border between the islands, where it's much less noticeable and easy to enforce. So far the UK gov has rejected both, since DUP has them by the balls.

It's time to face reality, that quitting the CU and getting a host of "lucrative" trade agreements independent from the EU is just a fairy tale. Anyone still believing in it, has a complete lack of common sense and even less understanding of international trade.

The whole Brexit debacle stems from a single issue - every government in the past decades has had 0% interest in doing what's best for the country and 100% of what's required to get them re-elected. A downward spiral of running down the country, that culminated with the Brexit referendum. And now the Tories have managed to shoehorn themselves into an impossibility - any kind of Brexit will cause at least short term harm to the economy, losing them the elections. Cancelling Brexit altogether will anger a lot of Brexit supporters and most likely lose them the elections. Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

The only question now us, how to f**k the country just enough to set the next Labour government to fail, so they can win the following election. It all has nothing to do with the "will of the people" or what's best for Britain, it's all about what's best least worse for the Tory party.

You're probably close to the mark, although I don't see a great deal of difference between this and the EU's unbending approach to the four pillars despite the huge damage to southern European countries over the last decade. The whole Irish border thing is a total red herring. Since when has anyone in GB or the rest of the EU given a stuff about it? Ironically the DUP's involvement might, just might, mean that a sensible deal will have to be reached. Highly unlikely though.