Dear EU,

[PurpleGorilla]

Not quite true:

Is the EU really run by unelected bureaucrats? : Democratic Audit UK

https://youtu.be/f0wFii8klNg

[Lost It]

We didn't though. That's why we tried for years to join the EEC. Britains GDP was declining relative to EUrope's from the end of the 2nd world war to the 70s.

Britain’s EU membership: New insight from economic history | VOX, CEPR’s Policy Portal

GDP unfortunately is only a part of it. "We have never had it so good" was a fair statement at the time. The NHS wouldnever have been allowed to happen under EU rules. We had large indiginous industries back then, the world has changed and "we" have changed with it.
We joined the EEC to open markets up. It's cost us vast amounts of treasure ever since.

GDP didn't, and never has, made the population wealthy, only the moneyholders. I frankly become really annoyed when TV programs focus on how much the pound is worth, what stocks and shares have done, because your average GUP doesn't give a rats backside about that.

It's not "news" to them. What is relevant isn't mentioned at all. God is Money it seems. Not the health and welfare of the people who pay for everything through their hard won graft, that the infrastructure is collapsing, that they have to sell their house to keep their nan in a home because that welfare support has all been stripped out by the lastr two governments. Gone. That's what really matters to 99% of the population.

I'd like to believe I have a few working brain cells, and to me the focus on this is all in the wrong place. It seems to be "What's in it for the people that own everything". Not "What's the advantages to the ordinary working people and how to we achieve that".

IMHO.

[VectraMan]

I think that's what we used to call a conumdrum.

And I think you have pretty much hit what is the main problem. The EU is "run" by an unelected group who cannot be removed by the will of the people. Whichever way you look at it, that's a dictatorship.

That's why I voted leave. I believe in democracy and the use of a Parliament to act for the best wishes of the public. The EU doesn't.

I wish I had a pound for every time someone said "unelected". It's like when somebody asks a small child their opinion and they just regurgitate something they heard their parents say without understanding it.

[BlasterBates]

I think that's what we used to call a conumdrum.

The EU is "run" by an unelected group who cannot be removed by the will of the people. Whichever way you look at it, that's a dictatorship.

The elected MEPs can sack the Commission whenever they want.

So yes it is democratically accountable.

[meridian]

I think that's what we used to call a conumdrum.

And I think you have pretty much hit what is the main problem. The EU is "run" by an unelected group who cannot be removed by the will of the people. Whichever way you look at it, that's a dictatorship.

That's why I voted leave. I believe in democracy and the use of a Parliament to act for the best wishes of the public. The EU doesn't.

Unelected?

So, who did you vote for in the last European Elections then, and do you even know who your MEP is?

[BlasterBates]

The NHS wouldnever have been allowed to happen under EU rules.
I

This is a bit like the previous statement about dictatorship, i.e. just plain wrong.

[northernladyuk]

Unelected?

So, who did you vote for in the last European Elections then, and do you even know who your MEP is?

Is that the best you have?

[Lost It]

Isn't it a funny kind of dictatorship where member states have to apply to join, but can leave at any point according to their own democratic mechanisms? Could you talk us through that?

Yes. If you buy AA cover for your car then you are in. If you don't, you aren't. (Other breakdown organisations are available). If they force you to pay for AA cover, then it's a dictatorship.

Are we "Forced to pay". Or do we actually have a choice?

Another way. Cameron went cap in hand to them and (I hope) explained to them that if he didn't bring something tangible back, something solid, something he could with no element of doubt say "This is what we have got", anything to show that they had agreed to what he was asking for then there was a huge risk that the people might reject the EU.

They were so sure.... They offered maybe's and possibly's. Nothing concrete, nothing etched in Granite and unfortunately for them a bigger proportion of that same GUP weren't happy. That's democracy in action. EU said no. Not possible. Our way or the Highway. Did the "leaders" ask each and every member state for their opinion? Nope. Did they think through worst case? Nope.

I have no doubt whatsoever they were shocked when Brexit happened. I was slightly even though I voted for it.

So was it Cameron's failure or the EU's lack of foresight?

Bit irrelevant anyway. A50 is done.

[sasguru]

GDP unfortunately is only a part of it. "We have never had it so good" was a fair statement at the time. The NHS wouldnever have been allowed to happen under EU rules. We had large indiginous industries back then, the world has changed and "we" have changed with it.
We joined the EEC to open markets up. It's cost us vast amounts of treasure ever since.

GDP didn't, and never has, made the population wealthy, only the moneyholders. I frankly become really annoyed when TV programs focus on how much the pound is worth, what stocks and shares have done, because your average GUP doesn't give a rats backside about that.

It's not "news" to them. What is relevant isn't mentioned at all. God is Money it seems. Not the health and welfare of the people who pay for everything through their hard won graft, that the infrastructure is collapsing, that they have to sell their house to keep their nan in a home because that welfare support has all been stripped out by the lastr two governments. Gone. That's what really matters to 99% of the population.

I'd like to believe I have a few working brain cells, and to me the focus on this is all in the wrong place. It seems to be "What's in it for the people that own everything". Not "What's the advantages to the ordinary working people and how to we achieve that".

IMHO.

Good rant. Unfortunately it makes no sense.
Yes there was large indigenous manufacturing industry in the 50s.
That was destroyed by (1) poor management (putting Comet in the air without proper testing for example) (2) unions in the 70s and (3) given the coup de grace by Thatcher in the 80s.
In the EU now, Germany of course, but even France, Italy and the Netherlands export more goods than us. The latter 2 much smaller in population.
So clearly the EU doesn't cause manufacturing decline - the failure of our manufacturing is entirely due to our own mistakes.

[northernladyuk]

Yes. If you buy AA cover for your car then you are in. If you don't, you aren't. (Other breakdown organisations are available). If they force you to pay for AA cover, then it's a dictatorship.

Are we "Forced to pay". Or do we actually have a choice?

So if you are forced to pay for your AA cover while you are an AA member, but can cancel your AA membership at any point, is that a dictatorship?