breeze

[PhilBreeze]

Then why cite the case as being relevant when defending your product?

Lisa, I was saying that your point about section 43 was only relevant to EBTs/FBTs, not the entire case.

Like what?

Erm, that contributions to the trust were potential emoluments held by the trustees with a view to becoming relevant emoluments, therefore no CT deduction was available until the funds were paid out of the trust as emoluments.

Perhaps you could explain why the individuals using your scheme are not subject to UK income tax

Again not entirely sure where you got that from, UK resident individuals using our product are subject to UK income tax, on any income they receive.

How relevant is it today?? It relates to products that have been made illegal by statute 10 years later

Part of the decision relates to any discretionary trust. FA2011 did not outlaw discretionary trusts, only a subset of them.

Any case law concerning EBT's or FBT's will have no bearing since the introduction of legislation last year as this will over-ride existing case law

I respectfully disagree. The case law has wider implications which relate to other types of trust. The legislation of last year only applies to specific types of trust.

[PhilBreeze]

b) That interest is not applied - I am less convinced about this, despite their assurances that there is no interest.

Penalties cannot be applied but interest can, the current HMRC rate is 3%.

e) That you sit on top of the money for 6 years and not be tempted to spend it, because you thought you were buying into something that was "risk free"

The fee reimbursement that someone would receive from the insurances would provide the majority of the funds needed so if you wanted to be cautious you would need to retain around another 5% (on £300/day), not all of your money, and of course you get to keep any interest/gains on that 5%.

[PhilBreeze]

The only way you can be risk free is if you don't bother with it I reckon.

Go Ltd and use pension contributions..

And don’t draw dividends. And ensure your company is fully compliant with all UK laws & company regulations. Also bear in mind that the pension contributions will be taxed when you finally receive them.

[PhilBreeze]

the subsiduary of the scheme operator that had the obligation to repay the fee was put into bankruptcy.

That’s why our insurance is underwritten by a third party. With A- to A+ ratings.

Also anyone comparing our product to the BN66 schemes should note that there is case law supporting our product whereas the BN66 schemes were based on opinion ONLY – albeit highly qualified opinion.

[FiveTimes]

2. I worked for Sunday Solutions as a salesperson. I was one of about 20 salespeople. When Sunday went under I was “transferred” to Fleming Laing along with a number of Sunday clients and other staff. That was about 10 months before the tax deadline. When it became clear the Sunday clients were not getting their tax money the following January, I handed in my notice at Fleming Laing not least due to concerns over the true management and control of that company. A lot of people lost a lot of money, I lost my job. I have sympathy with anyone affected, Fleming Laing had a large number of ex-Sunday contractors and I know first-hand the amount of stress and trauma caused to these people. It’s a disgrace. Anyone affected is welcome to contact me and I will try to help them as best I can, I can’t promise that anything I know will be of help but justice has not yet been served in my opinion and if I can help anyone affected of course I will.

Handing your notice in isn't the same as losing your job.

[geoff from contracta IOM]

To be fair, at least these guys have stuck around - they must have known they were walking into a barrage of questions and not too nice comments (a bit like Geoff from another scheme I can't remember).

Mind you
1) I've no intention of taking them up on their offer and
2) I had nothing to do with Sunday

To me it's another loan scheme that pays the fees back if it goes south. It will be right for some people who are prepared for the risks involved and not for others. I only hope that those that do go for it go with their eyes open and understand what 'no risk' means in this instance.

Contracta dezze

[speling bee]

Hi spelling bee,

1. Personally I believe our claims about risk to be justified as the worst that can happen is you end up with the tax bill that you would have had, had you not used Breeze – plus interest (currently 3%).

2. I worked for Sunday Solutions as a salesperson. I was one of about 20 salespeople. When Sunday went under I was “transferred” to Fleming Laing along with a number of Sunday clients and other staff. That was about 10 months before the tax deadline. When it became clear the Sunday clients were not getting their tax money the following January, I handed in my notice at Fleming Laing not least due to concerns over the true management and control of that company. A lot of people lost a lot of money, I lost my job. I have sympathy with anyone affected, Fleming Laing had a large number of ex-Sunday contractors and I know first-hand the amount of stress and trauma caused to these people. It’s a disgrace. Anyone affected is welcome to contact me and I will try to help them as best I can, I can’t promise that anything I know will be of help but justice has not yet been served in my opinion and if I can help anyone affected of course I will.

3. Mark and I are the sole partners of Black Box.

4. As I said I was a salesperson at Sunday Solutions and Fleming Laing. I also worked for Sunday Solutions’ international brand, Von Essen, for about 6 months while I was working at Sunday. Before launching Breeze I was a director at CBN Global which I left in January 2012.

5. Robert Venables QC :
“In my Opinion, the Trust Deed settled by me for my Instructing Solicitor has the effect that:
- contributions to it are not prevented from being immediately deductible for corporation tax purposes by the Unpaid Remuneration Rules (i.e. Corporation Tax Act 2009 sections 1288 and 1289);
- contributions to it are not prevented from being immediately deductible for corporation tax purposes by the Employee Benefit Contributions Rules (i.e. Corporation Tax Act 2009 sections 1290 to 1296);
- the settled property should fall within Inheritance Tax Act 1984 section 86;
- the proposed new Part 7A of Income Tax (Earnings and Pensions) Act 2003 should not apply to the trusts and powers created by it.”

Thanks for the full response, Phil. What did you do at Von Essen? Did you have any senior management position in any similar type of company before CBN Global?

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

Lisa, I was saying that your point about section 43 was only relevant to EBTs/FBTs, not the entire case.



Erm, that contributions to the trust were potential emoluments held by the trustees with a view to becoming relevant emoluments, therefore no CT deduction was available until the funds were paid out of the trust as emoluments.



Again not entirely sure where you got that from, UK resident individuals using our product are subject to UK income tax, on any income they receive.



Part of the decision relates to any discretionary trust. FA2011 did not outlaw discretionary trusts, only a subset of them.

I respectfully disagree. The case law has wider implications which relate to other types of trust. The legislation of last year only applies to specific types of trust.

But their 'income' will be generated by the work that they do whilst under contract in which case the whole amount is subject to income tax/corporation tax; if this 'income' is paid to a third party and then paid to the individual as some sort of loan which has no other purpose than to avoid tax, the arrangement is a sham and highly likely to be challenged by HMR&C

[PhilBreeze]

Thanks for the full response, Phil. What did you do at Von Essen? Did you have any senior management position in any similar type of company before CBN Global?

You're welcome spelling bee. I sold tax, payroll and immigration solutions to expat contractors. No senior management positions in the industry prior to CBN Global.

[speling bee]

You're welcome spelling bee. I sold tax, payroll and immigration solutions to expat contractors. No senior management positions in the industry prior to CBN Global.

Thanks again for the responsiveness.

So what have kinds of outfit you and Mark run before? Extract from Black Box webiste below. Is this you and Mark who have the 20 years' experience or soemone else (who?)

Expertise

Our team is a multi-disciplinary practice combining the skills and experience of specialists from a diverse range of professional backgrounds, including Law, Taxation, Finance, Accountancy, Fiduciary and HMRC.

Over the past 20 years, our team has developed an unrivalled track record of successfully implementing our strategies on behalf of individuals and businesses numbering into the thousands. As specialists in their individual fields, they work alongside our clients’ existing advisers throughout due diligence to explain the basis of each proposed strategy.

This expertise provides our clients with a comprehensive and holistic approach to identifying the appropriate tax strategy to use, specific to their circumstances and objectives.

The net result of which is that our clients are afforded a significant tax advantage.

Expertise | Black Box