No To Retro Tax – Campaign Against Section 58 Finance Act 2008

[smalldog]

sign....going to repost this as got caught up in troll noise:

Im in a bit of a quandary, I have a property I could sell to pay most of my accelerator notice, BUT if I sell now there will be CGT due as part of the normal process of selling an asset.

So Im wondering whether I wait and when the bill arrives offer it up for sacrifice and HMRC might decide that as part of a settlement, and that I personally am not making any gain as all Monies go to HMRC they might waive any CGT. any thoughts and anyone else in the same boat and if so do you have a cunning plan?

[cheakyp]

sign....going to repost this as got caught up in troll noise:

Im in a bit of a quandary, I have a property I could sell to pay most of my accelerator notice, BUT if I sell now there will be CGT due as part of the normal process of selling an asset.

So Im wondering whether I wait and when the bill arrives offer it up for sacrifice and HMRC might decide that as part of a settlement, and that I personally am not making any gain as all Monies go to HMRC they might waive any CGT. any thoughts and anyone else in the same boat and if so do you have a cunning plan?

I would be very very surprised if HMRC let you off one type of tax in order to settle another. That sounds like being far too reasonable and I just can't see them ever "waiving" a tax (unless you're a big international corp and treat senior HMRC bods to fine dining).

[smalldog]

I would be very very surprised if HMRC let you off one type of tax in order to settle another. That sounds like being far too reasonable and I just can't see them ever "waiving" a tax (unless you're a big international corp and treat senior HMRC bods to fine dining).

agree and understand but technically am I making the gain if HMRC take ALL the equity? It probably a technical question and I can see an argument for both sides, be interesting to see which side it falls on should it come down to it.

[Old Greg]

agree and understand but technically am I making the gain if HMRC take ALL the equity? It probably a technical question and I can see an argument for both sides, be interesting to see which side it falls on should it come down to it.

Interesting question, but it seems that there is a capital gain between the selling price of the house and the original purchase price of the house. The fact that you have a similarly sized debt doesn't appear relevant to the gain.

[SantaClaus]

agree and understand but technically am I making the gain if HMRC take ALL the equity? It probably a technical question and I can see an argument for both sides, be interesting to see which side it falls on should it come down to it.

It's a pity you can't class the tax avoidance scheme as an "investment". If it was, it could be offset as a loss against your CGT gains.

But then I'm not an accountant. Probably best to get professional advice.

[cheakyp]

agree and understand but technically am I making the gain if HMRC take ALL the equity? It probably a technical question and I can see an argument for both sides, be interesting to see which side it falls on should it come down to it.

Nice idea and I see where you're coming from. I suppose if HMRC took direct possession of the house then you would not directly receive any gains. But not sure if you can just hand over assetts onto them that easily.

[jamesbrown]

agree and understand but technically am I making the gain if HMRC take ALL the equity? It probably a technical question and I can see an argument for both sides, be interesting to see which side it falls on should it come down to it.

They won't care where the money comes from or what secondary losses you might entail from liquidating assets (there will be secondary losses, of course, not to mention the wider impacts on family life etc.). So, technically and practically, since you'd be making a taxable gain on liquidating any assets, whether they forced you to do it or not, there would be tax due on any gain, I'm pretty sure. As they see it, you owe them an amount of money that needs to be paid and you should've managed those risks when participating in a "risky" scheme (I'm not saying I agree with it, just that it's the approach I expect they will take). And, to play the devils advocate, they might equally argue that the capital gain was afforded to you by participating in the scheme.

[AtW]

I dislike Farage but see no problem with him having those lectures on a side invoiced via Ltd, it makes sense - uneducated journos don't understand that 20% corp tax isn't the only tax he'd pay - in case of dividends he'd pay extra income tax. So no issue here really as it's clear he is not a permie in disguise for that activity.

Those of you who hope some politician would be on your side should bear in mind that Govt needs tax and ANYBODY who gets in power would have same objective - keep tax flowing as otherwise whole system collapses and THAT person will be held responsible. Be grateful it's not a fascist country where you'd be doing long time in jail for tax evasion.

[smalldog]

ok, thanks for the thoughts. Basically im best off in that case not flogging it at all and telling them to take it off me, then no CGT due. They can take a 2nd charge on it.

However I think its still quite an interesting one and not clear cut, if the crown takes an asset from you but you have to sell it first, does it raise CGT liability. I will be sure to ask HMRC when the time comes before deciding what to do, so for now I will sit on it. Selling it now generates a CGT liability guaranteed.

[Retro]

I dislike Farage but see no problem with him having those lectures on a side invoiced via Ltd, it makes sense - uneducated journos don't understand that 20% corp tax isn't the only tax he'd pay - in case of dividends he'd pay extra income tax. So no issue here really as it's clear he is not a permie in disguise for that activity.

Those of you who hope some politician would be on your side should bear in mind that Govt needs tax and ANYBODY who gets in power would have same objective - keep tax flowing as otherwise whole system collapses and THAT person will be held responsible. Be grateful it's not a fascist country where you'd be doing long time in jail for tax evasion.

Jail for tax evasion?
Stick to the subjects that you know something about.