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BN66 - Time to fight back (Chapter 3)

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    A rant

    Right – get a coffee, and get comfortable: on my 1 hour motorbike ride to work I have been mulling over the mother of all rants……………….

    I, like many I suspect, stumbled into contracting after being made redundant. It seemed a fair deal – in exchange for taking a greater element of risk, you could be paid a bit more than you might get as an employee. Of course, all the other costs need to be taken into account – accountancy; indemnity insurance; critical illness / permanent disability insurance; time off for holiday or sickness; not to mention trying to fund a pension.

    I’ve taken my knocks – periods out of work; contracts cut; rate reductions. But overall, it seemed fair middle ground, and I enjoy the flexibility

    But as with everything with this odorous, grabbing, pernicious government, they weren’t happy. Oh no – despite the fact that you have no job security, no benefits, and are the first to get the chop for whatever reason, Gordon and his henchmen introduced IR35 in an attempt to say that I and other contractors were actually employees. And, as we employed ourselves, we would actually end up paying more tax than a “normal” employee (through paying employer and employee NI).

    I spent a lot of time, and money, p*ssing around with contract reviews to ensure that I would not be caught by IR35 legislation. Then I was contacted by my then Agent who said they had checked out a new scheme which was safe. Now, I am actually not averse to paying a “fair” level of tax, but I was getting more and more riled by the moves above. I looked into it, took advice, and generally came convinced that it was above board, and joined up.

    Then, of course, I started getting the threatening, bullying letters from You Know Who – I shall call him Voldemort. Yes – this did concern me. But over time, I am become more and more angry, and have decided that I will not be pushed around.

    I do not have a problem with people in public service. I recognise there is a place for secure jobs with secure benefits. I also recognise the need to collect tax. But when these people fail to realise that they are elected civil servants, and start to behave in a distinctly uncivil way, I turn from being a law abiding citizen to someone far more petulant.

    Yes – the Dual Tax Treaty scheme was probably a bit near the knuckle, but there seems little doubt that it was legal. HMRC screwed up – simple as that. Fair enough, rewrite the legislation and we all move on. Try to apply the rewrite retrospectively, though, and to quote our Atlantic Cousins, you are in a whole new ball game.

    Give us a fair, level playing field, and I for one would not complain.

    Any attempt I have made to secure the future of my family is currently being undermined, in large part by the failures of this government. Pension funds raided by the government and decimated; property prices down; stocks and funds on their knees………………….. My wife currently has a (private sector) final salary pension scheme, but how long will this last?

    So how dare a protected, guaranteed final salary civil service act in this way? Do they not realise how much of our money is going to fund their retirements? There was a guy on the radio the other day smugly talking about how the recession had been okay for him as he had been able to take retirement from a Council at 53 – but he was a bit put out that he wasn’t able to claim Job Seekers allowance as he was on a pension! The sheer unadulterated nerve of it………………… I was spitting blood.

    W*nker.

    I still remember when Labour got elected. The smugness of it. “Things can only get better” blaring out of the stage. Yes, things have got better……………. if you form part of the burgeoning public sector. Anyone else just seems a target. A few mph over the speed limit – Fine………Motorbike in a bus lane – Fine. There isn’t a farting in public fine (that I am aware of) – yet.

    I remember a colleague of the time, about 55 years old, saying that you lot don’t know what’s coming – last time round, you just felt as though someone had their hand in your pocket all the time.

    He was right…………

    Right, I shall go and find a darkened room with some rubber wall paper now…..

    Comment


      Originally posted by xantamisch View Post
      I remember a colleague of the time, about 55 years old, saying that you lot don’t know what’s coming – last time round, you just felt as though someone had their hand in your pocket all the time.

      He was right…………

      Right, I shall go and find a darkened room with some rubber wall paper now…..
      Every labour government there ever was has screwed the country up, they just cant help it. dont worry dude, 14 months and counting....

      Comment


        Originally posted by nuffsaid View Post
        Just in case Turfer's response to DR was missed (because of the newbie posting delays).
        See his important point at the end.



        Turfer, how do you know the HMRC are using the change to section 858 of ITTOIA 2005?
        Due to post importance Admin has upgraded!
        Last edited by BrilloPad; 27 January 2009, 11:01.

        Comment


          Correction

          Originally posted by Turfer View Post
          In answer to these points:

          1) There are few here who would disagree

          2) Steed Solutions started work on this argument on the 12 March 2008, but they only put it forward to HMRC after the legislation was passed. A brief spoiler is that HMRC's response 4-5 months ago was as follows:

          As the life tenant in an interest in possession trust, your client is entitled to the income to which the trustees of that trust are entitled as partners of a partnership. As such, your client is entitled to the income of that partnership and since s58 puts it beyond doubt that those entitled to the income of a partnership are members of that partnership, it follows that s58 applies.

          This is not an argument that has been accepted by Steed Solutions.

          3) This is a red herring, HMRC aren't using the change to the TCGA to attack IT contractors they are using the change to section 858 of ITTOIA 2005, which clearly makes reference to income.
          Turfer is correct.

          Montpelier's main argument is (1).

          Their supplementary argument is (2), which as Turfer says, is more of a long shot.

          (3) is a red herring.


          PS. I have retrospectively "clarified" my earlier post:

          http://forums.contractoruk.com/752826-post1175.html

          Unlike HMRC, at least I am honest enough to admit my mistake.
          Last edited by DonkeyRhubarb; 27 January 2009, 11:13.

          Comment


            dont understand

            Originally posted by BrilloPad View Post
            Just to post importance Admin has upgraded!
            Sorry being really thick here , don't understand

            how can they be relying on legislation from 2005 ??, why was there the need for the retrospective legislation if the 2005 legislation could be used against us ??
            also if that is the case and the 2005 act is not retrospective then 2002 to 2005 taxation would not be due ???

            confused of confused-ville

            Comment


              Originally posted by DonkeyRhubarb View Post
              Turfer is correct.

              Montpelier's main argument is (1).

              Their supplementary argument is (2), which as Turfer says, is more of a long shot.

              (3) is a red herring.


              PS. I have retrospectively "clarified" my earlier post:

              http://forums.contractoruk.com/752826-post1175.html

              Hey, if HMRC can f**k up, and then change the past retrospectively, then so can I!!! At least I am honest enough to admit it.
              Over time we could learn to forgive you...

              Comment


                The law of unintended consequences

                [QUOTE=xantamisch;753756]Right – get a coffee, and get comfortable: on my 1 hour motorbike ride to work I have been mulling over the mother of all rants……………….
                QUOTE]

                Excellent post.

                At some point I intend to write to the Conservatives and let them in on a little secret as to why there has been such a plethera of tax avoidance schemes in recent years.

                You notice how the Government never mentions that it is Contractors who are using these schemes. It's always property developers or some other bunch. Even though they know it full well, they would never admit that it is their very own IR35 legislation which has caused this.

                Repeal IR35, and all of this will go away in a flash.

                Comment


                  [QUOTE=DonkeyRhubarb;753830]
                  Originally posted by xantamisch View Post
                  Right – get a coffee, and get comfortable: on my 1 hour motorbike ride to work I have been mulling over the mother of all rants……………….
                  QUOTE]

                  Excellent post.

                  At some point I intend to write to the Conservatives and let them in on a little secret as to why there has been such a plethera of tax avoidance schemes in recent years.

                  You notice how the Government never mentions that it is Contractors who are using these schemes. It's always property developers or some other bunch. Even though they know it full well, they would never admit that it is their very own IR35 legislation which has caused this.

                  Repeal IR35, and all of this will go away in a flash.
                  Here Here,

                  I would never have left Ltd, if it wasnt for my IR35 audit wasting 2 years of my life...winkers
                  When is comes to the HMRC and Gordy. Im a fighter not a lover

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by DonkeyRhubarb View Post
                    Repeal IR35, and all of this will go away in a flash.
                    I'd go back to LTD co tomorrow if I thought that IR35 wouldn't come back and bite me later.
                    It was the unfairness and uncertainty of IR35 that pushed me to look for tax avoidance methods. If my tax liability was going to be uncertain and open to challenge, why not increase my potential reward and get the backing of a larger company. Enter MontP...

                    Comment


                      New liebour could do with some education in basic economics...

                      In economics, the Laffer curve is used to illustrate the idea that increases in the rate of taxation do not necessarily increase tax revenue. (For instance, a 100 percent income tax will generate no revenue, as citizens will have no incentive to work). Increasing taxes beyond the peak of the curve point will decrease tax revenue.
                      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve

                      Thanks to R1 for this link

                      Comment

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