Being Forced To Go Permie

**SimonMac** · 5 January 2016, 12:42

You are not being forced to go permie, you are being offered a permie job rather than an extension.

The reason they are offering a permie job rather than a contract extension is irrelevant.

**MrMarkyMark** · 5 January 2016, 12:42

Ask the Finance Director to clarify.
There is no one year limit that has any baring on IR35.

Although, that having all being said it may be internal policy, which can be whatever they wish to implement.

**Mister Clark** · 5 January 2016, 12:43

Originally posted by tommy5dollar View Post

Hello,

I've done a quick browse and can't see any threads on this or similar topics but apologies if this is a common question and I've missed something!

I started my first contract this time last year, a 3-month one that has been repeatedly extended and is still ongoing.

I recently informed them that I'd be increasing my rates and was called into a meeting with the Head of IT.

There I was told that they were happy enough with the rate increase as I was worth it and they were keen to keep me on.

The Head of IT said though that he'd been informed by the Head of Finance that "IR35 won't allow us to keep on contractors for longer than 1 year" and that I'd have to go permie if I wanted to carry on there.

I responded by saying that I'd never heard of anything like that and that it sounded like nonsense wherein I was told that it "might not be IR35 per se" but instead one of the various certifications the company holds.

I've tried searching around and can't see anything relevant to this. Has anybody ever heard of anything like this before? Normally I'd suspect it was BS to get me to go permie but my relationship with the Head of IT has been very good to date. I'm going to push for further clarification but I'd rather be suitably armed before doing so.

Thanks in advance,

Tommy

From what you describe it sounds as if your client doesn't understand IR35 rather than anything more underhand.

My suggestion would be to fully understand the details of their concerns re the 1 year limit and then explain to them why this is a non-issue.

**LondonManc** · 5 January 2016, 12:44

Sounds like a company contractor retention policy. I've know a few places operate them. At one point, one clientco in the north was operating an 11-month limit with a return in 3 months possible but that was as much to protect themselves from contractors having permie rights before the IR35 tuning went in. Two years is not uncommon; companies were finding that one year was not long enough, given that many projects were 18 months in duration. Similarly there are exception processes that they can go through to get you extended. If you feel you're holding the better hand then hold your never but you MUST be prepared to walk if you play hardball.

**northernladuk** · 5 January 2016, 12:45

It's not because of IR35 but many companies have limits on contractors. The banks are very well know for it with 12 Month and 24 month rules. Dunno where they really come from. Could be misplaced fear of IR35 or employment rules or just a policy that any role being done by a contractor for over 12/24 months should be being done by a permie.

I personally wouldn't cause too much fuss at the client to try get round this. It's their rules for one reason or another then so be it. It isn't for suppliers to bully clients in to changing policies. You are a contractor. You should be thankful you got a full year in and them just go find another client. It's what we do.

**MrMarkyMark** · 5 January 2016, 12:47

In addition, if you hold your ground they may choose to raise an exception.
They will only do this, if they really value your services, however.

This:-

You are a contractor. You should be thankful you got a full year in and them just go find another client. It's what we do.

**LondonManc** · 5 January 2016, 12:53

Originally posted by northernladuk View Post

It's not because of IR35 but many companies have limits on contractors. The banks are very well know for it with 12 Month and 24 month rules. Dunno where they really come from. Could be misplaced fear of IR35 or employment rules or just a policy that any role being done by a contractor for over 12/24 months should be being done by a permie.

I personally wouldn't cause to much fuss at the client to try get round this. It's their rules for one reason or another then so be it. It isn't fornsuppliers to bully clients in to changing policies. You are a contractor. You should be thankful you got a full year in and them just go find another client. It's what we do.

The crux of the matter, right there.

Is the OP a contractor? I got offered perm in my second contract. The training on offer was tempting but that was short-termism kicking in and trying to overtake what I actually had planned for a longer term future.

OP - are you a contractor or do you want to go back perm?

**WTFH** · 5 January 2016, 13:02

Originally posted by LondonManc View Post

Is the OP a contractor? I got offered perm in my second contract.

15+ years ago I used to judge how well I had done in a contract on whether the client offered me a perm position. Have been tempted twice, but resisted so far.

**MrMarkyMark** · 5 January 2016, 13:04

FTFY

Originally posted by WTFH View Post

15+ years ago I used to judge how well I had done in a contract on whether the client begged me to take a perm position, which I subsequently refused and then received an extension

Being Forced To Go Permie