New side business: Legal aspects clarification

[b0redom]

I've never heard of anyone needing to have their registered address for business at their home, rented or otherwise.

IMO I'd either move it to your folks' place (assuming they own a place), or your accountants office (assuming that they provide that as a service.

IANAL and IANAA.

[Milkyway]

I've never heard of anyone needing to have their registered address for business at their home, rented or otherwise.

IMO I'd either move it to your folks' place (assuming they own a place), or your accountants office (assuming that they provide that as a service.

IANAL and IANAA.

Hi - I am not talking about the "registered office address" at all.
Like i said before, it is currently registered at my accountant's address.

When it comes to Ltd companies, there are two different addresses involved.
1. Registered office address : I am sorted on this one. This is my accountant's address. This is registered in Companies house, etc.
2. Trading address - this is what i am talking about here.

Also accountants do not provide "trading address" service - any accountant for that matter.

I am talking about the "trading address" - which is what VAT registration needs.
They wont take your accountant's address or a virtual office address or in my case a hired serviced office address too for that either (since for IT contractors they say the home address is the deemed trading address - (see for details as to why in my earlier post)

[WordIsBond]

Well if HMRC insists that your home address is your place of business they shouldn't give you trouble on travel expenses, should they?

If it were me, I'd make sure I was very well-insured (PI and PL and EL) so that nothing ever comes back on your landlord, and carry on. I wouldn't be talking about running a business from there. You've got a different address for billing, etc. You aren't having clients / customers come there, you aren't advertising that address to anyone.

I think the "side business" factor is actually irrelevant. Your contracting business is as much "running a business" from there as the new side business is. In both cases, you aren't really using it as a place of business, and it isn't registered at that address, but HMRC tells you to call it your place of business for their purposes.

I'd just carry on, personally. If there is any real risk to your landlord, you should insure against it so he isn't going to be harmed.

But I'm just some guy on the Internet....

[VectraMan]

You're worrying over nothing. As said they don't want you opening a shop or hiring staff or whatever, but all you're really doing is working at home and that's unlikely to be an issue even if they do find out, which they won't.

I've used my rented house as registered office and trading address for VAT or whatever. All that really means is that's where they send the couple of letters a year to, and your mail is your business.

[SarahL2012]

Rented for 6 months last year. Landlord was happy for property to be used as correspondence address (inc VAT) but not registered address. Have you got the kind of landlord you could actually have a sensible conversation with?

[ConcurrencyOverload]

Hi Milkyway,

The worrying thing is that you seem to be the only person who is aware of this absurd situation. I've been contracting as a software dev for two months and have just been evicted. My ltd company is registered at my accountants', but as only you and HMRC seem to be aware, our residential address is required as our principal place of business (PPOB), which leaves us to the whims of landlords. How is it that no one else is aware of these requirements? How is it that we are subject by law to the various psychologies of landlords. This is utterly ridiculous and unacceptable.

My landlord found post addressed to my company - HMRC variously addresses post to both me personally and my company. My business bank does too. There are director service address services which will receive and forward mail addressed to me personally, but not if they're addressed to my company. I would have been fine if HMRC and the bank stuck to addressing me by name. As with you I had no customers at my residence, nor did I even work there as when I'm not at a customer's office I prefer coffee shops to avoid cabin fever.

I'm now in the situation of trying to find accommodation as a contractor which again is another level of hell compared to permanent employees. The amount of bureaucracy, and torment I've been through in the last two months means that I would never recommend contracting/freelancing/etc to anyone who does not already own a property.

HMRC have blundered this outright. I'm about to look at serviced offices, but you've pointed out that HMRC won't accept these. Looks like it's back to permanent for me. The UK can forget about an entrepreneurial society with this sort of clumsy incompetence. In the meantime I'm living in AirBnB flats until I can get a flat as a second rate citizen, and my post is still going to my old landlord. I hope it really pisses him off. I'm dumbfounded and shattered.

[SueEllen]

HMRC and the bank haven't blundered as the company and you are not the same legal entity.

It's up to you as an adult to talk to your landlord and explain what exactly you are doing.

There is also nothing stopping you using a close relation's address as your trading address.

If you are organised the only actual post that will come are banking letters, one statement a month, and the occasional letter from HMRC. VAT reminders can be sent by email and most of the rest of HMRC paper work can be sent direct to your accountant if they are registered as your agent.

[northernladuk]

It will piss your landlord off as it did me which just goes to make the situation worse as landlords will clamp down even harder on having any kind of business relationships with their properties.

[ConcurrencyOverload]

"It's up to you as an adult to talk to your landlord and explain what exactly you are doing."

You think I didn't? Your patronising suggestion is based on the premises that I'm a moron, that all landlords know what they're talking about, and are all reasonable. That's as absurd as this situation.

"HMRC and the bank haven't blundered as the company and you are not the same legal entity."

I wasn't referring to the varied addressing, I was referring to contractors/freelancers being at the mercy of landlords.

"There is also nothing stopping you using a close relation's address as your trading address."

You're doing nothing to improve the situation. The situation is that individuals are unable to independently and self-sufficiently be contractors and freelancers - ie that they are second rate citizens with fewer rights than landlords in relation to something that should have nothing to do with ones status of home ownership. Again an absurd premise that all contractors/freelancers have close family, or family at all. I can't believe I'm hearing these things. How does someones family have anything to do with a person's business arrangements? You speak of being an adult, then suggest falling back on one's parents.

"If you are organised the only actual post that will come are banking letters, one statement a month, and the occasional letter from HMRC."

Quantity has nothing to do with it. If the landlord doesn't want you receiving business related mail, then one letter is too many. I know from experience.

It will piss your landlord off as it did me which just goes to make the situation worse as landlords will clamp down even harder on having any kind of business relationships with their properties.

Worse than what? At best it's a crapshoot at the moment - crapshoot legislation - how is that acceptable? HMRC have to require landlords to allow tenants to get on with their business, or allow tenants to receive post elsewhere. Is that so difficult? That so much hassle can result from requiring an address is absurd. The government know everything about us, what need is there to require this address for communications?

[meridian]

Your tenancy contract is a contract like any other. It's not up to HMRC to require landlords to allow business post to your home address, it's up to you as one party to a contract to discuss exactly what you are doing with the other party (the landlord) and come to an acceptable agreement.

If the running of your business is no more than doing a bit of bookkeeping and issuing invoices once a week or month, then confirm that with your landlord. Some are fine with it, some aren't, but you need to negotiate your side of the pitch.

Not sure why you're having difficulties getting rented accommodation as a contractor, I've been doing it for years and it's usually no more difficult than verifying your contract details to prove you can pay the rent.