HMRC enquiries for EBT schemes through SANZAR

[ASB]

Not only that but I am also working with more companies than one so miles from being caught inside IR35

That is not, of itself, a get out of jail card.

[MrO666]

When it comes to IR35, just make sure your contracts are reviewed by a PCG affiliated company, and assuming they say it's ok, then make damn sure you have reputable insurance to cover both fees and liabilities should the worst happen.

Providing that's all in place, then why waste time worrying about it. If HMRC ask questions, tell them to talk to you accountant. Worst comes to the worst and you're caught by IR35, your insurance will cover all the costs.

I don't see what the issue is.

[cojak]

You actually have to be working outside of IR35. Having a contract outside won't work if your working practices don't align with the contract. Do some research and understand what IR35 is and what is expected of you and your company.

[MrO666]

I understand that it's more than just reviewing a contract of course I do, and that there are further things to consider.

However, I'm sure a very large number of contractors know damn well that they are within IR35, and it's purely the contract wording and other elements which keep them out of its potential grasp.

No doubt loads of people will probably tell me that they're true consultants etc, but I've been a contractor for 19 years and I'd say I've only ever met about 10 people who truly did run consultancies offering services to multiple clients and truly running as a business.

Let's be clear here, the one man band working exclusively for one client at a time is in all honesty more than likely within IR35. They may argue they're a true consultancy, but you, me and everyone else knows they're not.

Don't get me wrong, I'm as keen to stay out of the reach of IR35 as anyone, but I'm just stating it how it is.

[malvolio]

Don't get me wrong, I'm as keen to stay out of the reach of IR35 as anyone, but I'm just stating it how it is.

No you're not, you're generalising. Doesn't matter a damn how many clients you have at a time, since IR35 is based on a per contract basis. And if you are not under the Direction and Control of your client, you aren't caught by IR35.

D&C is them telling you how to work, not what work you should be doing. Most competent professionals should be able to pass that test.

And if I source my own work, carry the risk that I won't have any or won't get paid if I do and fund all my own social care funding and provide my own tools, on what basis am I not in business?

[Michael J Perry FCA]

Free initial advice and help line

Those that have any open enquiry with HMRC or tax assessments under appeal should seek professional advice now.

If the current proposals for changes in tax legislation become law later this year, you will have limited time to respond and should use the interim period to prepare.

HMRC have stated they want to extend their proposals to target users of schemes which were DOTAS registered and that could put ex-employees of schemes such as Sanzar Partnership and Sanzar Solutions at earlier risk.

We are acting on behalf of many contractors already and can provide initial advice in confidence without charge or obligation.

[jbryce]

Those that have any open enquiry with HMRC or tax assessments under appeal should seek professional advice now.

If the current proposals for changes in tax legislation become law later this year, you will have limited time to respond and should use the interim period to prepare.

HMRC have stated they want to extend their proposals to target users of schemes which were DOTAS registered and that could put ex-employees of schemes such as Sanzar Partnership and Sanzar Solutions at earlier risk.

We are acting on behalf of many contractors already and can provide initial advice in confidence without charge or obligation.

I'm interested in your thinking here. The professional advice I have been given is wait and see what legislation is submitted to parliament off the back of the proposals.
The proposals have not been universally welcomed and legislation may well reflect some of the concerns that are being expressed - although I'm not holding my breath
So the germane words here is 'appeal'. Under the present framework, the appeal will be dealt with under due process and, at some point for those who hold on, we'll find out of the Courts consider the Sanzar scheme to be effective. If it wasn't effective we'll pay tax plus interest.

In the HMRC proposals, Sanzar users may be hit will accelerated payments with minimal ability to appeal the amount.
The thing is, until we see legislation - we will have no idea what is really proposed; if it does impact existing DOTAS appeals then surely that is the time to start panicking. Until then, the law gives us the right to our day in court.

Perhaps you are suggesting that we just agree with HMRC and pay up now on the basis of the bogeyman's latest proposals?

We should not stick our head in the sand, but, at present, we are not obliged to pay HMRC a penny.

[creativity]

I actually take Michaels comments as a good omen...
I have also been advised to wait until the legislation has passed in whatever form that may be.

Until then get a clear idea of what you could owe, calculate the values and think about where that might come from. That's the worst case scenario.

Any other scenario is then welcome.

I would be surprised to see the bill pass as it stands...if it does, well I'm off to new horizons, don't really want to stay in a country with such powers and contradictions. They can kiss goodbye to my future earnings.

[MrO666]

A quick question.....

If somebody decides to accept HMRC's assessment and pay the balance requested, what happens then ?

I'm assuming that as far as HMRC are concerned, then that's it. Unless HMRC find themselves in receipt of information which indicates you owe more than the assessment, then it's a closed case. If you offer no defense and just pay what they ask for, then there's little HMRC can do (or would want to do I guess).

Am I correct in thinking though that in order to get any assessment fully 'shut down', you would need to request a determination. Once that was paid in full along with any interest owed, I take it the case would then be closed in the eyes of HMRC.

I know I'm probably going to get the usual "HMRC can do what they want" responses, however in reality I'm sure that they want these cases closed too, as it doesn't do them any favours in having them open, as they can't then report on how many cases they're resolving.

The reason I ask, is that a colleague paid his assessment in full within 28 days of receiving it. That was over a year ago, and as it stands the money is still sitting as a credit on his HMRC online account, and the assessment is still showing against the tax year in question. It's like HMRC have had the money but have not done anything with it.

I'm interested to know the process that's all.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

The reason I ask, is that a colleague paid his assessment in full within 28 days of receiving it. That was over a year ago, and as it stands the money is still sitting as a credit on his HMRC online account, and the assessment is still showing against the tax year in question. It's like HMRC have had the money but have not done anything with it.

This is pure speculation but...

It sounds to me like HMRC have treated his payment as a "payment on account" and that the enquiry is still open. I'm assuming the assessment was based on an estimate? Although making a payment on account will prevent further interest accruing, the final assessment could still get adjusted up or down.

I think the normal settlement process would be for HMRC to issue a closure notice but they won't do this until they are satisfied that the assessment is correct.

Having said this, the only way to be sure what's going on is for him to contact them.