Windows 7 public beta released

[Clippy]

i have a copy and uploaded rars to a online file share. if you want the links, drop me a PM. (there are 25 files but download speeds are good)

Hey Scooby, can you PM the link please?

[voodooflux]

Let's be honest: P2P exists to make anti-piracy efforts harder. I'm not convinced it's really a good solution for anything, especially as most of us have much lower upload speeds than downloads. The likes of Microsoft (and the BBC for that matter) ought to just provide enough bandwidth to do things properly, IMO.

Indeed, I think it's naïve not to acknowledge the impact that piracy has over the development and uptake of P2P networks.

Technically I think P2P has merits though, with the potential to remove bottlenecks, reduce costs (it costs money to provide the bandwidth after all) and provide implicit redundancy. Indeed it seems to work well - I get some truly stunning download speeds from torrents, but never seem to get anywhere near these from a download over something like HTTP (where throttling can take place at the source).

There are other applications of P2P as well, many of which are now in the software you've just downloaded: Peer-To-Peer based Features in Win 7

[voodooflux]

I've got it installed under Virtual Box. As I suspected, it's turned off all the Aero stuff (so you don't get previews of the apps when you alt+tab etc.).

Thanks for the heads up - given that I think I'll dedicate a box to it for now. I like my eye-candy

Did you manage to grab it before they removed the download from the site, or via some other source?

[VectraMan]

Did you manage to grab it before they removed the download from the site, or via some other source?

Other, and I think he deserves a scooby snack for his efforts.

[voodooflux]

Other, and I think he deserves a scooby snack for his efforts.

Nicely done

[VectraMan]

Technically I think P2P has merits though, with the potential to remove bottlenecks, reduce costs (it costs money to provide the bandwidth after all) and provide implicit redundancy.

True, but the bandwidth used by P2P still costs money. The peers aren't necessarily people that are close to you, so the same amount of data is still being shuffled around the country at best, and the world at worst. Even if it's people at the same ISP, then the data still has to get from your local telephone exchange to the ISP via a backbone network (assuming ADSL this is), and this costs money too. And arguably, as the networks for home users are biased towards downloads anything that relies on uploads creates more headaches for the network.

My ADSL connection is 8Mb down, and I think 384 up, which means 21:1. So if everybody was the same, then I would need 21 peers uploading just to me to max out my download. And those 21 people would have had to download the file to be able to upload it, perhaps from 441 uploaders. And they would have had to get it from 9261 people ...

Not as good as a decent cache/multicast system should be able to acheive by far. In short, the network should be able to care of it, not third party software using home users limited upload speeds because the BBC is too stingy to pay for its own bandwidth despite charging me £140 a year just to watch Top Gear (oops did I start an anti-BBC rant).

[voodooflux]

True, but the bandwidth used by P2P still costs money.

I should have perhaps qualified my statement in that the primary beneficiary of any cost reduction would be the source - something of great benefit to non-profit organisations such as Mozilla. A lot of the local bandwidth is already there and underutilised - makes perfect sense to use it.

The peers aren't necessarily people that are close to you, so the same amount of data is still being shuffled around the country at best, and the world at worst.

It's probably more accurate to say that more data gets shuffled around as the single source bottleneck is removed. However distributing the source of the data does allow for utilising other parts of the network.

My ADSL connection is 8Mb down, and I think 384 up, which means 21:1. So if everybody was the same, then I would need 21 peers uploading just to me to max out my download. And those 21 people would have had to download the file to be able to upload it, perhaps from 441 uploaders. And they would have had to get it from 9261 people ...

Do you ever expect to max out your download speed? You should get a better download speed from P2P because you're not being throttled by a single source.

Not as good as a decent cache/multicast system should be able to acheive by far. In short, the network should be able to care of it

Aye, in a perfect world it would be great if we could all download direct from source at maximum speeds.

the BBC is too stingy to pay for its own bandwidth despite charging me £140 a year just to watch Top Gear (oops did I start an anti-BBC rant).

Just think of the network upgrade they could afford if they ditched Jonathan Ross

[voodooflux]

Looks like the download is still down:

Thanks for your interest in the Windows 7 Beta. The volume has been phenomenal—we're in the process of adding more servers to handle the demand. We're sorry for the delay and we'll re-post the Beta as soon as we can ensure a quality download experience.

I may need to take scooby up on his offer...

[voodooflux]

Looks like the download is still down

Scratch that - it's back: http://www.microsoft.com/windows/win...-download.aspx

[NickFitz]

I think the reason MS won't distribute something like this via BitTorrent (or similar) is simply security - it's way too easy for somebody to start seeding an apparently-legitimate download full of trojans, keyloggers, spambots, etc.

We all know that, although Betas shouldn't be used for real purposes, there are still people who will "upgrade" their day-to-day machine and use it as their usual OS. One dodgy torrent, and some of those people are fscked.

And even though it's their fault for using a Beta for real-life purposes, and the fault of the people who distributed the dodgy installer, guess who gets the blame and all the bad press? Yup, MS.