Holidays not allowed between contract renew/extension

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

When you work through an umbrella company, they should deduct a certain amount from the contract each week/month which is then paid back to you as holiday pay when you have a break between one assignment and the next. There is no other way for your umbrella to deal with this I'm afraid (trust me, I know, I tried to get an answer from Brussels when the EC Working Time Directives came out, to no avail and that was after having no joy with HMRC, the DTI (as it was then) and ACAS). If they haven't accounted for holiday pay in this way then there is still an obligation for them to pay you between assignments (an amount usually based on the living wage/minimum wage element of the employment contract).

I think the problem here is that the business to business contract between the umbrella company and the agency has no break and therefore their records will show that there is no pay owing. That said, the fact that you will, presumably, not enter a timesheet for the 10 days in question will demonstrate that you haven't worked in that period. Put this to the umbrella company and see what they say

[northernladuk]

Hi
Thanks for the answer.

at point 1)

I finish at 10th of month X.
The new contract started at 20th of monthX.
I am not entitled to claim holidays between 10th to 20th day of month X because I have no assignment.

I don't really know brolly's but please learn the difference between a holiday and you not being in assignment that you are not paid for. This time between assignments is very common. If you've done a year solid without being on the bench you are very lucky. Most of us do 3 or 6 month assignments so will spend time on the bench a few times a year. This is the way we work. You will have to get used to it. Most of us view 12 months plus solid working as a bonus, not the norm.

The agency told me to start at 20th
I start the new contract at work at 20th of monthX but the start date of my contract will be officially 11th of month X.
result: from 11th to 19th I taken holidays (now I understood it is a worst choice surely!!!!) without to be paid for these days.
because the Umbrella company didn't know from the agency what is my next assignment and when I will start until my official past contract is ended.

That's because of the delay getting authorization and the like so they haven't bothered to go back and change the date, no biggie for the reason I'll explain at the bottom.....

at point 2)
I know that the agencies are never never friend of mine. but as a contractor I dont have the knife on the right side.

As I mentioned earlier, as a contractor you hold all the cards. Client doesn't get work done if you don't do it and the agent doesn't get paid. You have the biggest knife of the three. If you tell them you won't be taking the gig if they don't pull their finger out they will jump to attention. You hold a lot of power as the contractor. You need to learn this.

Usually they told you that the client doesnt want give you a higher rate.
Before the end of the contract(one month before) I asked the agency to sort out the renew/extension of my contract but again, again again they use the time as their ally.

Why should they give you a higher rate? You are still doing the work you originally contract at so why are you suddenly worth more. The agent will have lost commission on the days you didn't work as well so don't always assume it's the agent that is to blame.

at point 3)
I missed this.
I know that I will loose totally the holidays this end of the year but I assumed I am employee of an Umbrella company and not for the Client. then I supposed to use my holidays between contracts to avoid gaps.
Wrongly.
now I will use holidays when I have a contract but in this case I use completely all available paid days.

this year I used only 10 days of my allowed paid holidays (10 out of 28). At that point I will have to work more to compensate the giant loss I got this year

Ring the umbrella and get them to explain your situation fully so you don't make any more mistakes. They are your employer but still it's on you to understand your situation.

10 days isn't a giant loss. Wait until you are on the bench for a month plus. If 10 days is a giant loss you are going to have some really really bad times ahead of you.

- How is possible to work at 20th day and have a contract starting before this day. if you are not at work and not allowed to have a paid holiday.??
- only one positive thing I think is good. the agency doesnt get money from my services if it sets the starting day of my contract before my real date.

Read your contract carefully. There will be a line in there saying you are paid upon receipt of a signed timesheet. If you didn't work you didn't get paid. You have a contract to cover a period. That doesn't mean you get paid every day regardless. You only get paid the days you work. If they didn't need you for various reasons, you don't get paid. Welcome to contracting. I suggest you get your head around it quickly to avoid a lot of other upsets coming your way...... Like the 24 month rules which is going to hit you between the eyes and cause you a great loss!!!!!

You are aware having notice period in your contract can mean nothing and, although it's poor form on the client, there are ways of binning you on the spot and you have no rights?

[WTFH]

this year I used only 10 days of my allowed paid holidays (10 out of 28). At that point I will have to work more to compensate the giant loss I got this year

OK, since today is not 10th of the month or the 20th, then we can only assume the month this issue occurs is not December 2015, but some time in the future. So you still have some weeks in which to take your time off.


Secondly, if we are talking 9 calendar days (11th - 19th) then that is at the most 7 working days, but could be as low as 5 - or even less if there is a public holiday in there.
So, there is no "giant loss", you're missing out on some income - probably about 10% of your daily rate per day off. You will not need "to work more to compensate."
Put it another way, let's say you are earning £100 per day. If you were on "holiday" for 7 working days, your "giant loss" will be £70 in total. Which is less than 1 day's pay.



Or, if you want to think smart, take your holidays between contracts and forget about the 10% bit because it's better to earn £100 a day in contract than £10. That way you are £90 a day better off. 7 days at £90 a day is £630, which would pay for your holiday when you are between contracts!

[northernladuk]

they say everytime "sorry"
but as a contractor I am not in a good position to argue something.

You couldn't be more wrong but looking at the way this thread is going it's not worth going in to why.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

they say everytime "sorry"
but as a contractor I am not in a good position to argue something.

Ok, what date is on the contract renewal and what is the termination date of the original contract?

[northernladuk]

Just as an aside you had a one year contract and have a renewal. Do we assume this is a one year renewal in which case you can't claim expenses any more.. If you only end up working with this client before leaving the umbrella you might also have to pay the expenses back.

http://www.allumbrellacompaniesareeq...onth-rule.html

Who is the umbrella? One of the big companies or one offering visa sponsorship?

[justanother78]

I don't really understand what you're saying here but if there is a disparity between your contract start date and your actual start date - have you asked the agency??

they say everytime "sorry"
but as a contractor I am not in a good position to argue something.

[northernladuk]

No way we can begun to grasp this situation with such poor English but a couple of things for you to consider.

You are employed by your umbrella. If you have any questions you should be asking them first. They are your employer so should explain everything clearly to you. As has been said though there is a big difference between taking holidays whilst in a contract and you not being in a contract. You need to understand the fundamentals of what you so.

Also with the agencies it can be their fault but to be fair it is often the clients that can't get the authorisation is place in time. If this is hell for you you are not going to enjoy contracting in the long run. This is pretty common and so is the gig/renewal falling through at the last minute.

Whatever the bit about set back is supposed to mean then always speak to the agent for clarification..

Do some reading around the forums and the newbie guides to the right. Sounds like you've a lot to learn about contracting.

[justanother78]

1. What do you mean by "a starting date set back"?


2. Agents are not your friends. They are in business to make money. They will do things when they want to, and when they can make the most money


3. If you are between contracts then you are not in a contract so you cannot have holiday pay from an umbrella company. Remember, you are a contractor, not a permie.

Hi
Thanks for the answer.

at point 1)

I finish at 10th of month X.
The new contract started at 20th of monthX.
I am not entitled to claim holidays between 10th to 20th day of month X because I have no assignment.

The agency told me to start at 20th
I start the new contract at work at 20th of monthX but the start date of my contract will be officially 11th of month X.

result: from 11th to 19th I taken holidays (now I understood it is a worst choice surely!!!!) without to be paid for these days.
because the Umbrella company didn't know from the agency what is my next assignment and when I will start until my official past contract is ended.

at point 2)
I know that the agencies are never never friend of mine. but as a contractor I dont have the knife on the right side.
Usually they told you that the client doesnt want give you a higher rate.
Before the end of the contract(one month before) I asked the agency to sort out the renew/extension of my contract but again, again again they use the time as their ally.

at point 3)
I missed this.
I know that I will loose totally the holidays this end of the year but I assumed I am employee of an Umbrella company and not for the Client. then I supposed to use my holidays between contracts to avoid gaps.
Wrongly.
now I will use holidays when I have a contract but in this case I use completely all available paid days.

this year I used only 10 days of my allowed paid holidays (10 out of 28). At that point I will have to work more to compensate the giant loss I got this year



- How is possible to work at 20th day and have a contract starting before this day. if you are not at work and not allowed to have a paid holiday.??
- only one positive thing I think is good. the agency doesnt get money from my services if it sets the starting day of my contract before my real date.

[WTFH]

Hi everyone,

I am new here.

I started working as a contractor one years ago and now i am having a second extension.

My questions are (related on my case):
- Why the contracts are nenewed at a starting date set back than the day you really start to work?
- Why the agencies don't tell useful information about the current situation about the contract renew/extension with a good notice time leaving you in the hell?
- Why the Umbrella companies don't pay holidays between assignment if the new contract will start at a time set back than the real working days and it will covers the holidays?

Thanks for the answer.
Just.

1. What do you mean by "a starting date set back"?


2. Agents are not your friends. They are in business to make money. They will do things when they want to, and when they can make the most money


3. If you are between contracts then you are not in a contract so you cannot have holiday pay from an umbrella company. Remember, you are a contractor, not a permie.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

I don't really understand what you're saying here but if there is a disparity between your contract start date and your actual start date - have you asked the agency??

[justanother78]

Hi everyone,

I am new here.

I started working as a contractor one years ago and now i am having a second extension.

My questions are (related on my case):
- Why the contracts are nenewed at a starting date set back than the day you really start to work?
- Why the agencies don't tell useful information about the current situation about the contract renew/extension with a good notice time leaving you in the hell?
- Why the Umbrella companies don't pay holidays between assignment if the new contract will start at a time set back than the real working days and it will covers the holidays?

Thanks for the answer.
Just.