Reply to: Dave Chaplin's anti IR35 campaign

[JohntheBike]

I'm sure we'd know if you had.

I've had some of my digestive tract removed.

[northernladuk]

you are assuming that I've not had a colostomy.

I'm sure we'd know if you had.

[JohntheBike]

Well at least you'll have plenty to wipe your bum with when she brushes you off.

you are assuming that I've not had a colostomy.

[northernladuk]

yes, you are probably correct. But with a paper trail of letters, I can surely confront her. If her aides have said something that she doesn't agree with, then she will have egg on her face, and so will her aides. I'll wait until the paper trail is complete.

Well at least you'll have plenty to wipe your bum with when she brushes you off.

[JohntheBike]

Exchanging letters won't have any effect. Your MP probably hasn't even seen them. The aides will handle it with the standard lines. You actually need to go and see your MP in person at one of their surgeries.

yes, you are probably correct. But with a paper trail of letters, I can surely confront her. If her aides have said something that she doesn't agree with, then she will have egg on her face, and so will her aides. I'll wait until the paper trail is complete.

[NeedTheSunshine]

not yet, I'm still exchanging letters - building a paper trail as my solicitor would call it!

Exchanging letters won't have any effect. Your MP probably hasn't even seen them. The aides will handle it with the standard lines. You actually need to go and see your MP in person at one of their surgeries.

[JohntheBike]

So have you been to see her?

It really does make a difference. I got all the stock answers from my MP (or his 'researcher') but when I went to see him, he did seem to "get it".

not yet, I'm still exchanging letters - building a paper trail as my solicitor would call it!

[mudskipper]

my MP, Christina Rees, has already responded with the "tax avoiders" position

So have you been to see her?

It really does make a difference. I got all the stock answers from my MP (or his 'researcher') but when I went to see him, he did seem to "get it".

[JohntheBike]

He's still banging the 'go see your MP' drum all over LinkedIn. I severely doubt my Labour MP (in a fairly marginal seat with the SNP) would go against these 'anti tax avoider' reforms.

I admire the work he has done, but also think he will do not bad out of this in the short term. I took his IR35 test last night and was as far into the red it was possible to be - you can then pay £60 to see the detailed results why.

my MP, Christina Rees, has already responded with the "tax avoiders" position

[Barry Badrinath]

He's still banging the 'go see your MP' drum all over LinkedIn. I severely doubt my Labour MP (in a fairly marginal seat with the SNP) would go against these 'anti tax avoider' reforms.

I admire the work he has done, but also think he will do not bad out of this in the short term. I took his IR35 test last night and was as far into the red it was possible to be - you can then pay £60 to see the detailed results why.

[JohntheBike]

While I had thought that myself (living a reasonable distance from the city), what's the excuse for everyone working in London?

I'm sure if people could arrange their working hours to start early/work late, you know, control their hours and stuff, they may well have been able to attend.

No-one wants to lose half a day, but that half a day pales into insignificance when compared with what people will lose if blanket assessments (and the rest) become the norm post April 2020.

agreed

[ShandyDrinker]

Maybe if they held it on a non billable day and we could expense the milage.....

While I had thought that myself (living a reasonable distance from the city), what's the excuse for everyone working in London?

I'm sure if people could arrange their working hours to start early/work late, you know, control their hours and stuff, they may well have been able to attend.

No-one wants to lose half a day, but that half a day pales into insignificance when compared with what people will lose if blanket assessments (and the rest) become the norm post April 2020.

[northernladuk]

Exactly.



I'm pretty sure the entire plan wasn't to hold a banner outside Parliament as there was a drop-in session with a number of MPs attending later on.

Given the number of people likely to be impacted by whatever is in the draft finance bill tomorrow, I'm surprised there wasn't more support.

Maybe if they held it on a non billable day and we could expense the milage.....

[ShandyDrinker]

yes, there seems to be too much apathy with many contractors. Perhaps the reality will hit them next year.

Although I am concerned with the proposals, I can walk away from all the issues and retire. However, what concerns me far more is the unjust, unfair and underhand way in which HMRC has behaved in all things IR35 related. If they are not challenged now, it may embolden them more to bring in more draconian measures in other areas which many more people will suffer from. The situation of the NHS consultants is interesting to note. HMG is only taking notice because the NHS is suffering. Governments generally only change as a result of forceful pressure. The history of the UK should demonstrate that fact admirably.

As someone told me at the event yesterday, they were advised (by their MP) that the approach of HMT/HMRC is to collect first and deal with the aftermath later. The approach they've been taking certainly reflects that.

As you say, the situation with NHS consultants and the like may tip the balance. However, when dealing with IT contractors for example, they really don't care.

It was encouraging to hear of people in the public sector still managing to work outside of IR35.

CUK is completely unrepresentative of the broader contracting community. Even on CUK, there's probably a minority that know much about IR35.

Of the minority on CUK that know much about IR35, most of them understand that the time for protest has passed (although, TBF, they probably didn't do much in the interim, like actually read and respond to consultations ). The clue has been in the continuity over administrations and, more recently, in HMG's rebuttal of responses to their "consultations".

We're now in an implementation phase. No amount of gnashing of teeth and crying is going to change that; it isn't defeatism, it's realism. The whim of the next PM might upend things, but that seems like a long-shot. Also, no one can accurately predict the actual consequences of this reform N years down the line.

Sadly I think everything you say is spot on. The time for protest has really passed but it's still incredibly disappointing that more people couldn't be bothered to turn up.

In reality for anyone who hasn't gone permie, moved abroad or are in a safe outside IR35 contract, then at this stage everyone needs to be making plans to adjust to the new normal.

[JohntheBike]

CUK is completely unrepresentative of the broader contracting community. Even on CUK, there's probably a minority that know much about IR35.

Of the minority on CUK that know much about IR35, most of them understand that the time for protest has passed (although, TBF, they probably didn't do much in the interim, like actually read and respond to consultations ). The clue has been in the continuity over administrations and, more recently, in HMG's rebuttal of responses to their "consultations".

We're now in an implementation phase. No amount of gnashing of teeth and crying is going to change that; it isn't defeatism, it's realism. The whim of the next PM might upend things, but that seems like a long-shot. Also, no one can accurately predict the actual consequences of this reform N years down the line.

agreed