Reply to: HMRC enquiries for EBT schemes through Kinsella Solutions Ltd

[webberg]

Has anyone else received another letter from HMRC talking about changes announced in the budget 16 March 2016 ? allowing them a new charge on disguised remuneration and asking you to provide voluntary information of schemes you may have been involved in ?

Such notices are appearing frequently and you should seek professional advice.

That usually means, professional tax advice, not advice from the firm who sold you the scheme. Often they may know a lot about tax but are not capable of giving you an unbiased opinion.

[RajaStyle]

Has anyone else received another letter from HMRC talking about changes announced in the budget 16 March 2016 ? allowing them a new charge on disguised remuneration and asking you to provide voluntary information of schemes you may have been involved in ?

[ChimpMaster]

I had enquiry letters from HMRC regarding Runnymede and now Kinsella Solution over the past 20 months.


Is there a statutory date limitation for these enquires?

The HMRC are asking for information and documents for the financial tax year 2006 to 2008 relating to Kinsella Solutions LTD and also Solitude Holdings.

I quote from the most recent letter that I received in September 2016
"The HMRC are continuing to investigate these arrangements and do not accept that the 'loan repayment arrangements' succeed in mitigating the charge to tax on these payments"

<snip>

The HMRC asking for copies of my bank accounts from tax years 2005 to 2008.
Is there any human right that I can declare?

From what I've read on Google (yes it's a quiet day at work!):-



Is there a statutory date limitation for these enquires?
For timeframes, they can go back 4 years normally, 6 years for 'careless behaviour', 20 years for fraud (which I doubt would apply in this case).

The HMRC are asking for information and documents for the financial tax year 2006 to 2008 relating to Kinsella Solutions LTD and also Solitude Holdings.
I'm no expert on this but from what I've read: HMRC would need to have sent you a Discovery Notice (I think?) within the 4 or 6 year timeframe to begin the enquiry, and then they could take as many years as they wanted to investigate you. Did you receive a Discovery Notice for Kinsella before April 2015?


The HMRC asking for copies of my bank accounts from tax years 2005 to 2008.
Is there any human right that I can declare?

As far I as know, you only have to keep statements for 7 years. But perhaps HMRC can force you to pay the bank to pull out older statements?

[DotasScandal]

"Is there a statuary date limitation for these enquires?"

Yes. It depends of the type of "enquiry".

Normally, enquiry = 1 year after tax return submission. If it's a "discovery" (of something "dodgy"), it's 4 years (IIRC).
Either way, it doesn't seem to apply to your scenario.

I'd hazard that this is a fishing expedition. You probably have no legal obligation to provide this info.

If you have to respond (which is the recommended course of action, even if only to tell them to take a hike), it's safe to take professional advice first. (We recommend Big Group, but check with whoever you're comfortable with.)

PS: "intrusion of privacy"? Ha! HMRC cares about such thing about as much as the mafia does.

[rocktronAMP]

This thread is for those who have recently received a Discovery Asessement from HMRC for loans made via an EBT in 2008/9 using Kinsella Solutions Ltd.

I received notification March 1st of HMRC discovery. Would be interested in teaming up with anyone using the scheme and had the same letter. Like the other threads it seems we need to lodge an appeal and then align with all the other good advice.

I had enquiry letters from HMRC regarding Runnymede and now Kinsella Solution over the past 20 months.


Is there a statuary date limitation for these enquires?

The HMRC are asking for information and documents for the financial tax year 2006 to 2008 relating to Kinsella Solutions LTD and also Solitude Holdings.

I quote from the most recent letter that I received in September 2016
"The HMRC are continuing to investigate these arrangements and do not accept that the 'loan repayment arrangements' succeed in mitigating the charge to tax on these payments"

Surely, the HMRC ought to be chasing down the management and company director that set up these schemes. We, lowly, IT contractors were not the experts in the law. We choose these umbrella companies to save the hassle of running a limited company business. Why are they coming down so hard on the contractors rather than the scheme providers? Has HMRC actually caught up the original directors of the Kinsella Solutions schemes?

What about intrusion of privacy?

The HMRC asking for copies of my bank accounts from tax years 2005 to 2008.
Is there any human right that I can declare?

Actually, the financial tax year 2007-2008 was a particularly bad year for me when I was contracting. I had only won 2 short term contracts (2 and 3 months long). Eventually, I gave up and I found permanent employment by February 2008.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

Big Group looks at schemes based on type rather than product name.

Essentially anything with foreign currency loans (Castlemaine, Horizon) is type 1.

Type 2 is "early" EBT schemes like Edge.

Type 3 is later EBT schemes such as Cherrylon, Trentburg, Westhill etc.

Type 4 tends to be past 2011 schemes.

If your scheme is not named, send us details and we'll see where it fits.

There are countless promoters (products) but they are all just variations on the same theme (small taxable income + loan). Some were probably better implemented than others though. There were a lot of cowboys who jumped on this bandwagon.

[KMITL]

Great article, nicely balanced as well

Come on over to Big Group - The more the merrier!

I also just receive CLSO can admin give me right to PM others who receive the similar letter please?

[chubacabra]

FYI in the Telegraph paper 2 days ago

HMRC uses new powers on contractors: 'I was told to pay '£30,000 within 90 days' - Telegraph

Great article, nicely balanced as well

Come on over to Big Group - The more the merrier!

[RajaStyle]

FYI in the Telegraph paper 2 days ago

HMRC uses new powers on contractors: 'I was told to pay '£30,000 within 90 days' - Telegraph

[webberg]

Thanks for the info although Kinsella is not on their list of companies they are covering looking at those listed on their site. Are all these schemes of the same structure ?

Big Group looks at schemes based on type rather than product name.

Essentially anything with foreign currency loans (Castlemaine, Horizon) is type 1.

Type 2 is "early" EBT schemes like Edge.

Type 3 is later EBT schemes such as Cherrylon, Trentburg, Westhill etc.

Type 4 tends to be past 2011 schemes.

If your scheme is not named, send us details and we'll see where it fits.

[RajaStyle]

Yep join Big Group, many of us taking the fight to HMRC

Thanks for the info although Kinsella is not on their list of companies they are covering looking at those listed on their site. Are all these schemes of the same structure ?

[chubacabra]

Many are resisting it.Big Group is a good place to start.

Yep join Big Group, many of us taking the fight to HMRC

[DotasScandal]

Anyway would welcome any advice on how people are dealing with this are they reaching out to Mike Kerridge who was part of this facility originally or just negotiating/fighting/paying themselves ?

Many are resisting it.Big Group is a good place to start.

[RajaStyle]

couple of link I found, trying to dig around

Kinsella, Keypay and Berwick Associates

HMRC Enquiries for EBT Schemes through Kinsella Solutions Ltd

[RajaStyle]

Anyway would welcome any advice on how people are dealing with this are they reaching out to Mike Kerridge who was part of this facility originally or just negotiating/fighting/paying themselves ?