Reply to: Bad Refs

[Sinbad]

Geez Louise,

If you worked somewhere, where you feel (or know) that the boss/whoever has an axe to grind, then just scrub that engagement off your C.V.

We all pick bad companies, so why suffer when it comes to needing them for a reference ?

So your CV looks like this then:













































































.

[Board Game Geek]

Geez Louise,

If you worked somewhere, where you feel (or know) that the boss/whoever has an axe to grind, then just scrub that engagement off your C.V.

We all pick bad companies, so why suffer when it comes to needing them for a reference ?

[The Lone Gunman]

Are you telling me to put a sock in it?

Had I considered such a response, comedy value alone would have insisted upon it. However, my weekend's over exhuberance has precluded any kind of thinking beyond the most basic of function.

[DaveB]

Are you telling me to put a sock in it?

It'd be less painfull than a Biro

[Bagpuss]

I am not sure, but I think we did the socks one (and Biros) a feww weeks ago, try a search for it.

Are you telling me to put a sock in it?

[The Lone Gunman]

How about an article on where odd socks go to?

-Is there a parallel odd sock universe?

-Is it OK to wear odd comedy socks to the office?

-If we piled up the remaining socks how high would the mountain be?

-why do ladies not have this problem with their stockings?

We should be told.

The truth is out there!

I am not sure, but I think we did the socks one (and Biros) a feww weeks ago, try a search for it.

[WKnight]

Bagpuss: "How about an article on where odd socks go to?"

I suggest you start a thread on it. If it becomes popular and attracts many dozens of replies then I'll consider it next week.

Of course I might decide it has little to do with IT and therefore excludes itself. I agree, socks don't get the editorial they deserve.

[Bagpuss]

How about an article on where odd socks go to?

-Is there a parallel odd sock universe?

-Is it OK to wear odd comedy socks to the office?

-If we piled up the remaining socks how high would the mountain be?

-why do ladies not have this problem with their stockings?

We should be told.

The truth is out there!

[WKnight]

CUK comment on bad references

This week's surprise winner in hot topics for the CUK front page is this thread.

If you have comments about the relevance or otherwise of references, how you get round them, who to use, how often you get asked for them, then please PM me with your comments and they could be included in tomorrow's article.

Things like:

Do you know anybody that has sued in response to a bad reference?

Are references important, what's your opinion?

Do you still get asked to supply them? what do you do?

How often do you use your mate's ltd company to supply references?

How long will a bad reference taint your career? Ten minutes or ten years?

I want to hear your low-down dirty secrets about references; tell all, your anonimity is assured.

Cheers
William Knight

CUK writer

[hugebrain]

honest recruiters!?

One of the recruiters passed on the reference to the client that I am now with

What's wrong with your recruiter? Usually the pimps just ring up and say: "you got a bad reference from X, make sure you don't use them again. Obviously I'm not going to tell the client..."

[Alf W]

For references from a Permy role where you think you might have trouble simply provide an HR contact. All they will do is confirm when you worked there.

FFS though. A reference is where you tell them who to ask if you're any good. It's not rocket science to work out how to get glowing references each and every time.

For the record, I've never had any of my nominated referees ever phoned up to provide a genuine reference for a contract (some have been hassled by Agents though).

[expat]

English justice doesn't work like that, Pondlife. In a libel case the libellor is the accused and it is up to the libellee to prove it is libellous, not for the libellor to prove it isn't.

IANAL but AIUI it is up to the libelee to establish that the allegedly libellous statement was indeed published, and make a prima facie case that it was libellous*. If the defendant then puts forward the defence that the statement was not libellous on the grounds that it was true, it is up to him to prove that. (For those who like to throw about the phrase "innocent until proven guilty", which in any case applies only to the criminal law, I'd compare this with the defence of alibi against a criminal charge: if you defend a charge by claiming that you couldn't have done it because you weren't there, it is up to you to prove that).

PS Even the truth of the statement is not a defence in the admittedly rare case of criminal libel, see for example Goldsmith vs Ingrams et al (when Goldenballs sued Private Eye, in plain language). But if you can't afford Goldsmith's lawyers then you probably can't persuade the judge to "put the antique blunderbuss of criminal libel" in your hands. If I may say so.



* I.e. that the man on the Clapham omnibus wouldn't like to be called that. I have long wondered how it could be that the allegation that Elton John was homosexual could be libellous when it was't admitted that he was: presumably it is no longer libellous to publish that assertion, but the original case stands, i.e. John didn't have to give the money back and apologise when he came out.

[MarillionFan]

Only permies get asked for references. Contractors never do.

**** off permie!

[TheMonkey]

I had a period of rubbish attendance at a company due to the stress from the MD, falling down a drain cover and breaking my wrist, my wife being pregnant and general transport problems (Your fault WAGN) that has caused a lot of trouble in recent times. the bastards always give me a reference:

Technical capabilities: Outstanding
Attendance: 47%.

Lovely explaining that one.

[Spartacus]

I had a notice period of 2 months and since i was not getting any contract with that much notice i just called my manager , made up some excuse and buggered off

Ahhh, so if he said you were a good-for-nothing tulipebag in his reference, it would be true and therefore not libellous.

As previously suggested your options are now:

1. Be honest with your new client. Tell 'em how it is and hope they are understanding (not likely, after all, what's to stop you doing the same to them?).

2. Tell a porky and say your previous employer does not provide references (slightly risky as this can be verified easily).

3. Get a mate to masquerade as your previous PM, preferably someone who recently left the company. I doubt any real contractor here hasn't done that at one time or another (Spartacus' recommended option).