Reply to: "What sort of men tortured and killed Mary-Ann?"

[TinTin]

Not defending but...

Just catching up on the forum news after a busy week and I don't want to get into the black/white/Albanian racial argument. I don't want to start throwing grenades either, but from the stuff I read hopefully correctly (I hasten to add) the 2 girls were not the innocent virgins that I (like most here) thought they were. It was a case of gang warfare and the 2 girls merely belonged to another (white?) gang that 'befriended' the leading member of the black gang and stole a large amount of Class A drugs from him that were later sold for 000's of £s. Not in anyway condoning the murder but it helps to understand the reasons behind the hateful way it was executed. Mafia-type revenge like someone pointed out.

[mcquiggd]

I have no doubt that some currently violent and criminal third world countries will produce fine upstanding citizens one day, but as far as the present is concerned we need their citizens like a hole in the head.

All too often thats exactly what you end up with.....

[xoggoth]

I was commenting on general principles. I don't believe in this racial superiority stuff, it's all about cultures.

But don't knock McQ. Historic perspectives are all very well, but today's policies should be based on today's realities.

I have no doubt that some currently violent and criminal third world countries will produce fine upstanding citizens one day, but as far as the present is concerned we need their citizens like a hole in the head.

[expat]

gay

He!

[The Lone Gunman]

And what can we do with them?

Perhaps they should be tortured to death over a period of hours by a gang of female executioners?

gay

[expat]

And what can we do with them?

Perhaps they should be tortured to death over a period of hours by a gang of female executioners?

[threaded]

I wish to disagree that the armament and violence of these gangs is not government policy. If it wasn't government policy then why would they stop law abiding people holding such weapons with a license?

The government want these gangs to have such weapons and are actively encouraging it. They can then use such incidents as excuses to disarm law abiding citizens, track everyones movements, bring in the likes of ID cards etc. etc.

[expat]

Actually, why not just say it - blacks kill more people in the UK than white people do, as a percentage.

So go fix that problem.

Yes but Xog's comment was spot-on: in Chicago in the 30s it was Italians. It's not a skin colour problem (or whatever: "why is it when people look at me all they see is the color of my skin", Denzel Washington line in Spike Lee movie; meaning I think even if you are actually looking at race why see only the skin), but definitely a problem of some kind of groups.

[Fungus]

I think one problem is the availabiity of weapons. The disbanding of armed groups in Northern Ireland has released large numbers of weapons onto the market. There's also a lot coming from Jamaica, and apparently Yardie gangs are a serious issue, and rapidly spreading from London to other areas of the UK.

[mcquiggd]

Actually, why not just say it - blacks kill more people in the UK than white people do, as a percentage.

So go fix that problem.

[vetran]

you misunderstand me

Crabfat - it wasn't just skin colour, I think its a case of what limits your social circle sets. Yardies and various european gangsters seem to have lower thresholds for extreme violence they are now mixing with our home grown criminals and potential criminals 'setting an example'.

Combine that with a continous broadcast about 'respeck' and glorifying of violence aimed at specific social groups of young people and this I suspect will happen. Cut the sentences and its almost a foregone conclusion.

Just as Xoggoth suggested its probably the same in the Italian quarter.

I'm pretty sure pre - meditated gun crime was much lower 30 years ago - yes lots of twerps shooting the wives and burglars with a twelve bore but spraying the pavement with an UZI or gang rapes at gun point weren't common.

What have we done to make this an almost everyday event? Why do the more extreme crimes tend to involve certain ethnic groups? Why don't we target these groups to stop these crimes?

Pretty much Bill Crosby was saying. Fix the young on the correct path early.

It wasn't a pop at anyone with more melanin than me. That's stupid pretty much like singling out all those with freckles or big ears for special attention.

[bogeyman]

tulip happens, live with it.

Well, that's some tulip to have to live with.

Tell the parents of that girl that "tulip happens" and see what kind of response you get.

A good friend of mine died in a train crash (Paddington) and the guys in the pub said "oh! well - tulip happens - ha ha!" and then I suddenly realised that they weren't worth knowing at all.

[Churchill]

I couldn't give a tulipe about the murder, there are hundreds of people being murdered in one form or another every day.

Just another statistic and I refuse to be drawn into a debate about racial or socio-economic stereotypes.

tulip happens, live with it.

[crabfat]

Men like me ( Almost but not quite)

In response to the killing of Mary Ann, I, like all of the previous posts, am appalled at the actions of the scum lowlife who performed these acts.

With reference to ethnicity, I regret to say that these scum do wear the same colour skin that I do. Whilst I am proud of my ethnicity and the country in which I live, I take no pride in the actions of these men ( a term I use loosely). They in no way represent the honest law abiding members of this society wearing the same colour skin.

It is true however, that more members of some communities ought to be more forthcoming in seeking to shop these thugs when the need arises.

A previous post refer to statistics. Having served in the Gulf War and the Falkland on behalf of Queen and Country , I would suggest that statistics would show that there are numerous honest, law abiding and patriotic members of our society wearing this skin.

Having said all that, perhaps hanging should never have been abolished and should be applied no matter what the colour of skin.

[Dundeegeorge]

And that's why it's comedy

Only the denizens of CUK could make a comedy thread out of what must be one of the most horrific crimes in the UK’s recent history

Yes. They are all ‘ethnic’

Yes. They all richly deserve the ultimate sanction – a pity it is not within the remit of UK legislation to deliver it.

Because all the ******* liberals have decided that criminals are really victims.
I know I'd make them victims for damn sure.