Reply to: Are you a believer?

[doodab]

Well there is that line of thinking, the other that Jedi Knight isn't really a religion and it is just a entry that shows you don't agree with the rest. Kind of spoiling your ballot paper and saying I am none of the above.

Depends on whether you are geeky enough to really think you are a Jedi Knight or it is two fingers up to people that want you catagorised against a religion...

I really wouldn't flatter that by describing it as a "line of thinking".

[xoggoth]

In fact it definitely did. I just discovered some long losts scrolls that prove it.

[xoggoth]

Give it a few hundred years and a regime that has a political interest in promoting it. Maybe Christianity started out as a puppet show.

[northernladuk]

Well, not really, it's a way of saying you believe in "an all powerful force that binds everything in the universe together". As they don't have a god as such, that would make them atheists, as most Buddhists are, wouldn't it?

There ought to be some sort of "non-spiritual" category for the people who haven't thought about it and don't really want to. Anotgivashitstic or something.

Well there is that line of thinking, the other that Jedi Knight isn't really a religion and it is just a entry that shows you don't agree with the rest. Kind of spoiling your ballot paper and saying I am none of the above.

Depends on whether you are geeky enough to really think you are a Jedi Knight or it is two fingers up to people that want you catagorised against a religion...

Wonder which one this dick is

Political correctness strikes back: Jedi believer wins apology after being kicked out of Jobcentre for wearing a hood

[doodab]

Ok ok this is a discussion about not having a religion but putting yourself down as a Jedi is a away of not catagorising yourself as atheist/agnostic etc etc

Well, not really, it's a way of saying you believe in "an all powerful force that binds everything in the universe together". As they don't have a god as such, that would make them atheists, as most Buddhists are, wouldn't it?

There ought to be some sort of "non-spiritual" category for the people who haven't thought about it and don't really want to. Anotgivashitstic or something.

[northernladuk]

Where is Jedi Knight?

I don't believe in atheism or religion.

I would tend to agree but the problem with society being based on belief, holidays, laws etc etc the only way to describe yourself would be to be part of a group that differentiates yourself to the other beliefs however stupid the concept may be.

Anyway...

Epic fail on the options. Where is Jedi Knight???

390,000 people entered their religion as Jedi Knight (more than any of Sikhs, Buddhists or Jews), with some areas registering up to 2.6% of people as Jedi. Thus, 'Jedi' was fourth largest reported religion in the country

Ok ok this is a discussion about not having a religion but putting yourself down as a Jedi is a away of not catagorising yourself as atheist/agnostic etc etc

[xoggoth]

What a most sensible post.

[meridian]

I'm quite confused right now. Though I was born into a religion. I believe everyone needs a foundation of morals and ethics. As this doesn't come from the state one must get it from within or through another means. My parents did this through strict upbringing and religion.

Humans are social animals. Examination of other social animals (chimps, dolphins, etc) show that there is an innate and inbuilt sense of duty towards the community in which they belong - those that act out of selfishness and do things that damage the tribe as a whole can be attacked and banished, or killed.

Humans have an inbuilt sense of morals and ethics. However, as with other animals, if this morality is not nurtured and encouraged with society's own rules, the notion of what is acceptable and what is not can be blurred.

But I'm not sure I'm part of the 'right' religion and whether praying and the rituals makes any difference at all.

Why would there be a "right" religion? You either believe what you've been told, or you don't, don't you? Both the Bible and Koran are full of nasty stuff, if you believe in one of them why would you only believe in the nicey-nicey and not the nasty?

Looking around me I see a society in complete decay. Morals and ethics thrown out the window. Materialism is THE goal of life. Respect of others, and particularly elders is almost non-existent.

I witness my neighbour's young son. who is left to play out on the street on his own without supervision and is never chastised for his actions at all. The other week I spotted him throwing stones at my son and calling him names. When I complained to his parent I'm told "I'll have a word". This is the reality of England. 5 y/o's already into bullying, disrespect and negligent parenting.

Could this be a result of religious decline and the selfish and materialistic drive now prevalent in society? Or is it simply a result of a divided society. I don't know.

Bear in mind that under our society's rules, a 5 year old is incapable of making moral and ethical decisions. The parents are a different matter though.

Being left to play on the street at 5 is not uncommon in mainland Europe. But the UK does seem to have a certain element of society that are determined to go their own way and sod the rest of us. Hopefully evolution will take care of them, but I fear that that will be too late for those of us having to deal with them now.

[doodab]

I disagree. Agnosticism is about god, atheism is not.

Or shall we keep "atheist" for someone who positively believes that there is no god?

Then an agnostic is someone who believes that there may be a god but he doesn't and can't know anything about god.

Someone who isn't sure whether there is a god, but thinks that there might be, and it might be possible to know, is not an agnostic but a believer suffering doubt.

And what about someone who simply does not believe in god and has no time for the idea, but who does not hold as an article of faith that there is no god? If you call him either an atheist or an agnostic, you are forcing him into a religious classification, whereas the simple fact is that he is not religious.

An agnostic is one who believes the question cannot be definitely answered. That covers a whole spectrum of belief from the "rational atheist" stance that MTT has through those who simply refuse to commit either way to the believer with doubts.

There is another line dividing the strongly agnostic position that the question cannot ever be definitely answered (which involves it's own leap of faith) from those who believe that we may in fact be able to answer it one day.

An atheist would assert that there is no god. One can be an agnostic atheist in the same way a believer can doubt his faith, but both are also agnostics of some degree.

[xoggoth]

I believe everyone needs a foundation of morals and ethics. As this doesn't come from the state one must get it from within or through another means

Proper upbringing by parents teaching practical rules to enable us to get along should be enough surely? This is another area where religion seems to do nothing, the behaviour of children most clearly relates to practical factors, like prosperity and a stable loving family of two parents, not to their faith.

Think you are right on divided society, from elsewhere in the world social conflicts appear to be more of a factor in criminality than poverty.

[xoggoth]

Human society is about chosing sides and I think one sometimes has to make a firm decision about what you are going to believe even when there is no good reason.

Unfortunately, if there is a conflict of opinion and the outcome affects you in practical ways, you may not have a choice. Even if you think both viewpoints are idiotic, you have to go with the one that is least objectionable.

Personally, I find Dawkins and some others fanatical, non belief is like a religion with them. I'd still back them against the religious as (so far) I don't see them interfering in the law to get their views imposed on the rest of us.

[lilelvis2000]

I'm quite confused right now. Though I was born into a religion. I believe everyone needs a foundation of morals and ethics. As this doesn't come from the state one must get it from within or through another means. My parents did this through strict upbringing and religion. But I'm not sure I'm part of the 'right' religion and whether praying and the rituals makes any difference at all.

Looking around me I see a society in complete decay. Morals and ethics thrown out the window. Materialism is THE goal of life. Respect of others, and particularly elders is almost non-existent.

I witness my neighbour's young son. who is left to play out on the street on his own without supervision and is never chastised for his actions at all. The other week I spotted him throwing stones at my son and calling him names. When I complained to his parent I'm told "I'll have a word". This is the reality of England. 5 y/o's already into bullying, disrespect and negligent parenting.

Could this be a result of religious decline and the selfish and materialistic drive now prevalent in society? Or is it simply a result of a divided society. I don't know.

[Ignis Fatuus]

Ignis Fatuus

Not Bader meinhoff but a fairly recent EU report on terrorism shows that left wing groups are the main terrorists after separatists.

http://www.europol.europa.eu/publica.../TESAT2009.pdf

See also recent threats in Greece.

I stand corrected, insofar as I can allow such a thing to happen.


(I can believe six impossible things before breakfast, but I'll be damned if I'll admit to six mistakes before teatime).

[xoggoth]

Ignis Fatuus

Not Bader meinhoff but a fairly recent EU report on terrorism shows that left wing groups are the main terrorists after separatists.

http://www.europol.europa.eu/publica.../TESAT2009.pdf

See also recent threats in Greece.

[Platypus]

it's hilarious that people cling to such beliefs while marvelling at the stupidity of ancient civilisations worshipping the sun and nature etc

Amen to that!