Reply to: European Currency

[DodgyAgent]

You misunderstand Dodgy (might be my fault for not being clear).
I am not in favour, I am pointing out my opinion.
I believe that the only way Europe and the Euro could work is if everyone gave up their national identities.
I do not believe this will ever happen, certainly not by choice under the current populations mind set.
I also believe that as it is not achievable we should stop wasting money on ever more complex and costly European legislation and get back to a working common market.

Sorry LG you can leave Luxemburg now.

[DodgyAgent]

WHS

Wasn't LG was playing devil's advocate there?

In which case I am sure he will be pleaseed to hear that I have stamped his exit visa from luxembourg

[PM-Junkie]

You misunderstand Dodgy (might be my fault for not being clear).
I am not in favour, I am pointing out my opinion.
I believe that the only way Europe and the Euro could work is if everyone gave up their national identities.
I do not believe this will ever happen, certainly not by choice under the current populations mind set.
I also believe that as it is not achievable we should stop wasting money on ever more complex and costly European legislation and get back to a working common market.

a-flipping-men! Buy that man a drink!

[The Lone Gunman]

Why on earth do we want to be united? united in what? everyone accross the whole of Europe shops at Tesco? everyone speaks the same language? everyone wanders around with an "I am a Eurodrone badge" to who's benefit apart from Adolf Hiler would such "herding" of large swathes of our population be?
You people come on here and spit at the large banks being so big (quite rightly so) that no one can control them yet you openly support the homogonisation of the population of Europe under a single undemocratic government and currency.
People like having an identity, they like the feeling of belonging to groups, families and institutions. If you people have no friends and want to live in faceless communities then buzz off and live in Luxembourg and leave the rest of us to be different.

You misunderstand Dodgy (might be my fault for not being clear).
I am not in favour, I am pointing out my opinion.
I believe that the only way Europe and the Euro could work is if everyone gave up their national identities.
I do not believe this will ever happen, certainly not by choice under the current populations mind set.
I also believe that as it is not achievable we should stop wasting money on ever more complex and costly European legislation and get back to a working common market.

[cojak]

My apologies if this has already been discussed before.
I am a newby after all

What are your position regarding the UK joining the European currency?

Not for me, thank you...

What with the the ludicrous fact that they change parliaments every 6 months between Brussels and Strasbourg simply to sooth the humoungus French ego at a cost of God-knows how many millions of euros per year and that MEPs make our lot look like a bunch of Scrooges on the expense front, I've never been less keen on the Euro ideal than I am now...

[Doggy Styles]

Why on earth do we want to be united? united in what? everyone accross the whole of Europe shops at Tesco? everyone speaks the same language? everyone wanders around with an "I am a Eurodrone badge" to who's benefit apart from Adolf Hiler would such "herding" of large swathes of our population be?
You people come on here and spit at the large banks being so big (quite rightly so) that no one can control them yet you openly support the homogonisation of the population of Europe under a single undemocratic government and currency.
People like having an identity, they like the feeling of belonging to groups, families and institutions. If you people have no friends and want to live in faceless communities then buzz off and live in Luxembourg and leave the rest of us to be different.

WHS

Wasn't LG was playing devil's advocate there?

[DodgyAgent]

but the fact that you see it as controlling "our own economy" is indicative of the "little Englander though you mean UK" mentality.
That is the entire problem with Europe and the Euro. The whole thing is just about nation states trying to mould the whole thing to best suit them and not to use it to unite all member nations.
It can not work how they (European institutions representatives and supporters) present it to us (European citizens) unless all the Nation states commit to being one unit under one government with one economy.

They and we need to decide which way we are going. Total unification in which case we give up national identities in all but name and tradition or falling back to being a common market with agreed trading rules. This half arsed psuedo financial and political alignment is never going to work.

Why on earth do we want to be united? united in what? everyone accross the whole of Europe shops at Tesco? everyone speaks the same language? everyone wanders around with an "I am a Eurodrone badge" to who's benefit apart from Adolf Hiler would such "herding" of large swathes of our population be?
You people come on here and spit at the large banks being so big (quite rightly so) that no one can control them yet you openly support the homogonisation of the population of Europe under a single undemocratic government and currency.
People like having an identity, they like the feeling of belonging to groups, families and institutions. If you people have no friends and want to live in faceless communities then buzz off and live in Luxembourg and leave the rest of us to be different.

[Doggy Styles]

I don't think the Eurozone is going to break up. We're already through the worst part of the crisis.

first

[PM-Junkie]

We should just make Sterling the global currency and be done with it

yeah absolutely....everything goes belly up when we pull out. I mean, look at what's happened to the USA.

<runs for cover>

[Cyberman]

I don't think the Eurozone is going to break up. We're already through the worst part of the crisis.

It may not break up but all of the involved countries will suffer economic problems due to it as the interest rate will always be out of kilter for a number of member states. The UK is in a very strong position out of the Euro as long as we can get rid of incompetent Labour.

We should remove ourselves from a federal EU ASAP but remain a faithful trading partner.

[BlasterBates]

I don't think the Eurozone is going to break up. We're already through the worst part of the crisis.

[tino]

We should just make Sterling the global currency and be done with it

[PM-Junkie]

How do the Americans do it then? They seem to have one currency and the states setting slightly different taxes to suit their populations.

I don't claim any knowledge of economics but is this not what the EU should be?

No it is not. The EU was originally set up as a trading block. That is what we signed up to on the one occasion we were given a vote - the USA was set up as a federal constitutional republic from the original 13 colonies in 1788, not by forcibly amalgamating 13 countries. Poll after poll has demonstrated that right across Europe people are against creating a federal nation of Europe - and when a democratic vote is held on anything approaching the subject, it is ignored.

Unless the EU becomes a single economic entity, with uniform fiscal and monetary policy, the Euro WILL NOT WORK. Eventually it will fail - it has to. Anyone who thinks it won't is either naive or blind. That is why the constitution is being forced through and that is why written into the constitution are tools to accomplish a single european monetary and fiscal entity. Loads of examples - to name but three; article 14 gives the EU power to dictate how and to what level public services are financed; article 114 lays out powers for the EU to enforce economic "guidelines", and most crucially, article 48 stipulates that once ratified, ANY changes can be made to the constitution through QMV. So the much vaunted "red lines" that Brown brags about are worthless.

The government of the UK may be completely incompetent when it comes to economics, but they have been democratically elected, and can be removed in the same way. The Euro is a huge step toward moving that power to a bunch of people who are not democratically elected, despite even proponents of a federal europe agreeing that that is not the wish of the majority of the people of europe. Couple the Euro with the constitution, and it's a done deal. Notice how when a vote is taken on anything related to building a federal europe and it goes against the big plan, it is ignored. Why do you suppose that is?

Nope, you can keep the Euro thanks - I'll settle for having a bunch of corrupt incompetent idiots that can be democratically removed rather than a bunch of corrupt incompetent idiots that are untouchable.

[The Lone Gunman]

Which nations' people want that?

There are so many diverse micro-economies in Europe that it would be impossible to have one size fits all for a currency OR government. Even in England we have a north-south split, and Scotland are using their own limited tax and budgetary powers to diverge.

Oh, I agree entirely. That has been my stance for a long long time.
It may be possible for Europe and the Euro to work, but it will require incredible amounts of commitment from the member states.
The only small scale working example is the UK. As you rightly point out, that does not seem to be working too well these days.

[Smurficus]

How do the Americans do it then? They seem to have one currency and the states setting slightly different taxes to suit their populations.

I don't claim any knowledge of economics but is this not what the EU should be?