Reply to: Rate cut

[zara_backdog]

I'm in a similar dilemma. Current client is shedding contractors but wants to hang on to a few key ones for a few more months - I've just been offered an extension until end of March. However, at the time of my last extension I made it crystal clear that would be my final extension unless rates were increased.

Given the economic climate and lack of other opportunities I'll probably swallow my pride and accept the offer, but I had been quite looking forward to telling them where to stick it and moving on...

Thats OK as long as you have something to move on to.......

[Mich the Tester]

Once there it's not hard to outshine the Bulltulipters - just be aware of the back-stabbing and politics and engage with it.

That's what turned me off last time I did a test management contract; political manoeuvring by other managers, especially project managers who didn't like their bumbling being exposed by the tests. Still, it made me quite a bit tougher, so next time round I won't be taking tulip from other managers.

[sasguru]

That's a good point. I actually think the current crisis is an opportunity for techies to show that we can manage better than the airheads in charge right now. At some stage, businesses will have to get back to doing the basics right, and they'll need technically skilled managers to do it. That's one reason why I said on another thread that an MSc or an MEng might be a better choice long term than an MBA.

I know how to help a business save money AND test software more effectively; up until now, with unlimited budgets, nobody wanted to know about that; now that budgets are being cut, organisations might be prepared to listen.

That's more like it. We need more techie managers.
I think the best way is to have a strong techie background then do an MBA or similar as an entree to manager twat-land. Once there it's not hard to outshine the Bulltulipters - just be aware of the back-stabbing and politics and engage with it.

[Mich the Tester]

I agree. But if all techies can do is moan about management because they lack the personal skills (which are much harder than techie ones) required to obtain power - then nothing will change.

That's a good point. I actually think the current crisis is an opportunity for techies to show that we can manage better than the airheads in charge right now. At some stage, businesses will have to get back to doing the basics right, and they'll need technically skilled managers to do it. That's one reason why I said on another thread that an MSc or an MEng might be a better choice long term than an MBA.

I know how to help a business save money AND test software more effectively; up until now, with unlimited budgets, nobody wanted to know about that; now that budgets are being cut, organisations might be prepared to listen.

[bobhope]

Yes those poor contractors getting shafted, grossing only £100K per year. How will they survive Christmas... maybe we should set up a charity for them.

What's good for the goose, etc.

We need our own bailout now!

[Peoplesoft bloke]

Twas ever so. It's called survival of the fittest. Become a manager then and stop yer whinging.

Survival of the most venal and cut throat more like. Anyway I wasn't whinging I think it's funny - especially when permies go on about survival of the fittest

[d000hg]

Michael Moore makes this point - funny how top managers get richer and everyone else gets shafted

Yes those poor contractors getting shafted, grossing only £100K per year. How will they survive Christmas... maybe we should set up a charity for them.

[sasguru]

That’s the trouble; incompetent senior managers have been allowed to parasite businesses for too long and now we’re all left with the bitter aftertaste.

I agree. But if all techies can do is moan about management because they lack the personal skills (which are much harder than techie ones) required to obtain power - then nothing will change.

[Mich the Tester]

Twas ever so. It's called survival of the fittest. Become a manager then and stop yer whinging.

The ‘fittest’!?!?!?! Are you claiming that the thieving scum who have driven many of the world’s biggest banks and manufacturers to the edge, and some over the edge of bankruptcy are ‘the fittest’?

Darwinian evolution is the wrong analogy; basic home economics is better; in a stew, scum rises to the top and needs to be skimmed off quickly to avoid giving the whole meal a bitter aftertaste. That’s the trouble; incompetent senior managers have been allowed to parasite businesses for too long and now we’re all left with the bitter aftertaste.

[AtW]

Hence most contractors are on less now that they were 10 yrs ago.

(Except SallyAnne for some reason)

CyberTory

[sasguru]

Permie bastard.

[Moscow Mule]

Twas ever so. It's called survival of the fittest. Become a manager then and stop yer whinging.

Permie bastard.

[sasguru]

Michael Moore makes this point - funny how top managers get richer and everyone else gets shafted

Twas ever so. It's called survival of the fittest. Become a manager then and stop yer whinging.

[sasguru]

No problem with that AS LONG AS they see nothing wrong with me demanding a 20% rate increase mid-contract during a boom when their profits are good, without thinking for a minute that this is not a business like way to act.

I think you'll find your average client doesn't like it when the glove is on the other foot.

There is nothing wrong with demanding a 20% rise, even now, provided your added value justifies it. And if they have no choice they will pay it.
Simple supply and demand as I said.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

I love the way, that during a boom time for IT Contractors, anyone daring to put up their rates mid-contract is deemed unprofessional, money-grabbing and mercenary, but during a downturn, it is good business sense and ethical for clients to slash rates mid contract.

Michael Moore makes this point - funny how top managers get richer and everyone else gets shafted