Reply to: JP MOrgan to announce 15% rate cut

[ddaft]

My clientco is a large troubled bank and the management are so scared of a forced firmwide contractor cull that they are scrambling to convert as many half decent contractors as they can to permies. Packages seem good from what i've heard so far being above market and relatively similar take home wise. The contractor market in the city is dire so i may seriously consider...

[HairyArsedBloke]

I know someone at JP at the time - did not take time off. Just certain bits.

It annoyed the permies more! They had to work all over christmas/new year....

When I was a young, single and naive contractor I used to be happy doing the xmas bit and let the married ones with kiddies have the time off. I even ignored the fact that I was never rewarded or acknowledged for my efforts. Then one year I overheard some manager discussing staff rotas and words to the effect, “’protoHAB is only a contractor so we’ll use him to cover the holidays”. Nobody checked with me at all for over a week. An email went round reminding everyone to do their xmas holiday requests, so I sent in a notice telling them that I was not available for the two weeks of the holidays.

THEY WENT MENTAL! I got dragged into the senior manager’s office. Told how unprofessional I was, etc, etc. Not once did they acknowledge their presumption or offer me any incentive to change my position. I was out of there in the first quarter anyway and had work lined up so it didn’t matter. So I stuck to my guns; they shared the shifts between them and I went off to the sun (I wasn’t planning to go anywhere but someone got narky so I took a break in the afternoon and went round the travel agents and ended up in Miami for xmas).

After that experience I never allowed myself to be in that position. I encourage all that have had rate cuts to either have a full holiday or develop flu. If they say you are being unprofessional, just reply that professional people do no renege on done deals.

[BrilloPad]

few years back they also told contractors to take the 2 weeks for xmas off! that went down well with us contractors. mad

Was told it was across the board but loads of contractors never heard a thing about it, even those working in teams next to us!!!

Utter nonsense and was the beginning of the end for me there,

I know someone at JP at the time - did not take time off. Just certain bits.

It annoyed the permies more! They had to work all over christmas/new year....

[TheFaQQer]

I started my contract last month and just been told that they wana cut 15% rate.

I just started contracting and thats my very first contract since i made redundant from my Perm job couple of months ago.

Now, the issue is that im already on low rate (as compare to Market rates) and i also had to move for this contract.

Now, Im quite pissed with all this situation as this 15% deduction will be too much for my already fairly low rate.

From my perspective, a contractor takes a job risk and thats why makes big bucks. Now if i earn same (or bit more) as i'd in Perm, then whats the point.

Im not totally sure, but I think Im gona say If they really need me then we need to carry on with same rate.

So, whats the opinion of experienced chaps here??

If you aren't happy with the new rate, then don't take it. Don't make a big deal of it, but the whole point about contracting (as far as I am concerned) is to do something you like doing, at a rate that you are comfortable with. If you aren't happy doing it, then either change the rate, the client or the job - as soon as I start to get disenchanted with the role, then I leave at the end of the contract.

[TheFaQQer]

It would probably making an interesting anti-IR35 pointer too if you took a rate-cut for performing the same contractual duties.

No, it wouldn't. Same thing happened in Dragonfly - series of rate cuts for the same work as the rates dropped. And he was found inside IR35.

[Fred Bloggs]

Luckily it's never happened to me (yet) but I'd accept and then get on the phone/web until I had another gig lined up. It's pretty quiet out there and not the right time to walk out without another job signed and sealed IMO. However, I'm also seeing a lot of new jobs offered at rates probably 20% below what would have been offered 6 months ago. So if I was actually put in that situation, I'd tread pretty carefully.

[downsouth]

few years back they also told contractors to take the 2 weeks for xmas off! that went down well with us contractors. mad

Was told it was across the board but loads of contractors never heard a thing about it, even those working in teams next to us!!!

Utter nonsense and was the beginning of the end for me there,

[AtW]

banks take the p**s out of permies.

provide rewarding and morally enriching career for

[BrilloPad]

I started my contract last month and just been told that they wana cut 15% rate.

I just started contracting and thats my very first contract since i made redundant from my Perm job couple of months ago.

Now, the issue is that im already on low rate (as compare to Market rates) and i also had to move for this contract.

Now, Im quite pissed with all this situation as this 15% deduction will be too much for my already fairly low rate.

From my perspective, a contractor takes a job risk and thats why makes big bucks. Now if i earn same (or bit more) as i'd in Perm, then whats the point.

Im not totally sure, but I think Im gona say If they really need me then we need to carry on with same rate.

So, whats the opinion of experienced chaps here??

JPM were already on a low rate. I also hear that UBS are doing another 10% cut. If less than 20% go - I reckon could be another 15% in the spring.

Personally I am a contractor for the independance - banks take the p**s out of permies.

[BlasterBates]

There's the rub, experienced guys hardly ever get hit with these rate cuts, they're normally told in a quiet corner that it doesn't actually apply to them...

[Purple Dalek]

I started my contract last month and just been told that they wana cut 15% rate.

I just started contracting and thats my very first contract since i made redundant from my Perm job couple of months ago.

Now, the issue is that im already on low rate (as compare to Market rates) and i also had to move for this contract.

Now, Im quite pissed with all this situation as this 15% deduction will be too much for my already fairly low rate.

From my perspective, a contractor takes a job risk and thats why makes big bucks. Now if i earn same (or bit more) as i'd in Perm, then whats the point.

Im not totally sure, but I think Im gona say If they really need me then we need to carry on with same rate.

So, whats the opinion of experienced chaps here??

There's the rub, experienced guys hardly ever get hit with these rate cuts, they're normally told in a quiet corner that it doesn't actually apply to them, but not to say anything to rock the boat.

Many contractors actually earn less than what they could get as permies. Strange as it may seem, many aren't in it for the money.

Then there are some like the threadeds of this world who are so stratospherically rich, they contract just for the fun of it. Bastards.

[denver]

Still thinking what to do....

I started my contract last month and just been told that they wana cut 15% rate.

I just started contracting and thats my very first contract since i made redundant from my Perm job couple of months ago.

Now, the issue is that im already on low rate (as compare to Market rates) and i also had to move for this contract.

Now, Im quite pissed with all this situation as this 15% deduction will be too much for my already fairly low rate.

From my perspective, a contractor takes a job risk and thats why makes big bucks. Now if i earn same (or bit more) as i'd in Perm, then whats the point.

Im not totally sure, but I think Im gona say If they really need me then we need to carry on with same rate.

So, whats the opinion of experienced chaps here??

[DodgyAgent]

Whilst I'm a little uneasy with clients changing their rates part way through a contract, I'm also uneasy with all the contractors that seem to think no matter what the rest of the world is doing their rates should be maintained or even increasing.

On your first point, there is a large element of opportunism about this. Given the small amount of money that is at stake, a lot of this sort of behaviour is about people being seen to be tough and doing something. I also most certainly agree with your second point.

[Beefy198]

Whilst I'm a little uneasy with clients changing their rates part way through a contract, I'm also uneasy with all the contractors that seem to think no matter what the rest of the world is doing their rates should be maintained or even increasing.

[expat]

Or accept the reality of life... rates can go down as well as up.

My rates go up or down from one contract to the next. That's contracting. I don't put my rate up during a contract, including renewals; and if a client puts it down, I'd regard that as a new contract, which I might or might not want to take.

If you need to take it, then the rate is obviously high enough!