Reply to: NHS fees - right or wrong?

[BR14]

When what they should have said is that 4132 of the posts are boring

not 568 then?

[northernladuk]

Well, thanks to a couple of people on here, Mumsnet is no longer a safe place for CUK members.

The things they say about us, one even dared to say our forum is boring.

When what they should have said is that 4132 of the posts are boring

[woohoo]

Try Mumsnet!

Well, thanks to a couple of people on here, Mumsnet is no longer a safe place for CUK members.

The things they say about us, one even dared to say our forum is boring.

[Zigenare]

Actually, that is a good point. They can't afford to pay the bill and I'm guessing perhaps they could not afford to pay for travel insurance. How would they get the body back.

Now I'm thinking of dead bodies. Ok I need to find a more cheery thread to read.

Try Mumsnet!

[woohoo]

Umm unless they had a fridge to put that body in within a few days it would have looked like melted cheese and stunk to high heaven.

trust me I know.

Actually, that is a good point. They can't afford to pay the bill and I'm guessing perhaps they could not afford to pay for travel insurance. How would they get the body back.

Now I'm thinking of dead bodies. Ok I need to find a more cheery thread to read.

[original PM]

Should have handed back the babies body, it would be the decent thing to do.

They then should have gone after them for the fees after a few weeks.

Umm unless they had a fridge to put that body in within a few days it would have looked like melted cheese and stunk to high heaven.

trust me I know.

[Mordac]

I do know of case here where a tourist fell ill without their EHIC. They were able to claim retrospectively - but the authorities are not obliged to allow that.

In any case - if you travel outside your own country, even in Europe with an EHIC, make sure you've got proper travel insurance to cover any accident or sickness that, crucially, covers you to the same standard as at home. The EHIC is effectively a safety net, but it will only give you the same cover as locals. It won't get you home, repatriate your body etc.

Still, pretty callous of the hospital.

All this, and all day long. Take insurance, and not the cheapest insurance.

[NotAllThere]

They don’t, they should have an EHIC from Spain for travelling, and be charged for Private if they’ve booked treatment that they’r
Okay, the couple were probably traumatised at the loss of their baby. So why didn’t the NHS just help them out?

It was carried out by an bureaucrat/manager. No sense of humanity or decency.

If you are entitled to help but fail to fill in paperwork, the bureaucrats can do it retrospectively. But they don't have to.

[meridian]

and all the ex-pats living in Spain who come back to the UK for treatment to be told they no longer qualify for free treatment

They don’t, they should have an EHIC from Spain for travelling, and be charged for Private if they’ve booked treatment that they’re flying back for.

Should have handed back the babies body, it would be the decent thing to do.

They then should have gone after them for the fees after a few weeks.

For U.K. travellers in the EU, the NHS appears to do a Provisional replacement certificate (PRC) service, where if you are in a hospital on the continent and don’t have your EHIC card with you, you can call back to the U.K. and they will fax your entitlement to the other hospital.

Wonder why the couple (or the NHS themselves) didn’t just do this?

Okay, the couple were probably traumatised at the loss of their baby. So why didn’t the NHS just help them out?

[meridian]

EXACTLY. Try this in the USA - she wouldn't have got through the front door without a credit card or means to pay the bill.

EXACTLY. Always remember the story of the young lady who broke her back in Egypt. She was giving horse riding lessons apparently.

Two irrelevant stories about non-EU countries.

[NotAllThere]

Should have handed back the babies body, it would be the decent thing to do.

They then should have gone after them for the fees after a few weeks.

Especially since debts can be enforced across the EU.

[woohoo]

Should have handed back the babies body, it would be the decent thing to do.

They then should have gone after them for the fees after a few weeks.

[NotAllThere]

Agreed - withholding the body is well harsh....

About the USA. OK fair enough. Lots of "some will", "some won't" etc. Personally, I think its wise not to have to argue about whether its an emergency, whether insurer will pay etc.

Well of course. But my insurer guarantees payment to the provider - if it isn't covered, my insurer pays, and then comes after me.

[psychocandy]

Doesn't say where they were from - just Western Europe. For all we know, they might have popped across the channel on a day trip. So travelling 8 months pregnant isn't of itself irresponsible as you imply. If you read the article, you'll see that the person who reported this was a doctor - not the couple. We have no idea whether they cried over the £10K of emergency treatment - if you haven't got the money, you haven't got the money - most likely they were crying over the loss of their baby, which grief was compounded by not being able to take the body for a burial. And this was an emergency - not health tourism.

Being unable to bury your baby seems a bit of a harsh punishment for forgetting a bit of paperwork. (Though they would almost certainly have been out of pocket for the repatriation of the body).

Withholding the baby's corpse due to lack of immediate payment is sick.
Not true. In an emergency you will receive emergency treatment. Furthermore, even though some hospitals and medical centres may require payment up front for non-emergency care, not all do. Some will take a deposit on your credit card, some will be quite happy with an insurers guarantee of payment. Plenty of Swiss residents visit the USA every year. Some fall ill. But for some reason they don't have any difficulty getting treatment, even though a typical credit card limit is a few thousand, even for high earners.

Also not true. You obviously lump for the cheapest insurance you can get.

In answer to the original question posted by BP - yes, NHS fees are right and should be charged.

Agreed - withholding the body is well harsh....

About the USA. OK fair enough. Lots of "some will", "some won't" etc. Personally, I think its wise not to have to argue about whether its an emergency, whether insurer will pay etc. I'd rather bung a credit card to get things rolling without worrying about it.

e.g. if you're child is ill, upset but not dying, I'd like to get them seen asap rather than wait.

[SimonMac]

So at the same time as being outraged about foreigners using the NHS, people are outraged at foreigners being charged for using the NHS?

OK a glib comment, primary care is and always will be free. However the OVM process is a nightmare, and I should know as I was tasked with overseeing the design of the new process when I was working at NHS Digital.

Poor data comes from the Home Office on eligibility status, no centralised system so people can bounce from one trust to another without any cross checking and each trust interprets the guidelines in different ways often tracked on excel spreadsheets. Lets not get into the situation where once an invoice is raised the actual chasing of the payment, of and all the ex-pats living in Spain who come back to the UK for treatment to be told they no longer qualify for free treatment

The new system is with Department of Health and Social Care to approve funding, but fixing the system is not cheap