Reply to: PSR Alexander Mann - 33 days to get paid

[Paddy]

Hi Paddy

I am having a similar problem with Alexander Mann. They are refusing to pay me weekly. Do you have any advice on how I can avoid this, in particular if I’ve refused to be bound by their terms?

Your help would be greatly appreciated.

Kind Regards
Sandy

It depends on who is AM's 'end client' and what position you are in. I was working on a niche system and it was the end client who contacted me about the position. Their supplier was AM so there was no alternative. When AM told me their T&C's I said no and gave them an ultimatum of pay weekly else I will not sign. BTW: AM often make end clients pay two months in advance! They gain both ways. AM are very nasty people.

[Sandyb]

Alexander Mann payment period.

Alexander Mann was the company founded by Dragon's Den Khan chappie. The company staff are very arrogant. When they told me about their fee payment arrangement, I responded by saying that I will need to run a credit check on AMS; they went ballistic. However, they agreed to pay weekly at the end of each week.

AMS get paid by the end client and hold on to the money for weeks; what happens if AMS goes bust?

Hi Paddy

I am having a similar problem with Alexander Mann. They are refusing to pay me weekly. Do you have any advice on how I can avoid this, in particular if I’ve refused to be bound by their terms?

Your help would be greatly appreciated.

Kind Regards
Sandy

[Lance]

For how long? Thanks to lots of headlines like this:
Patients 'could have been harmed' after Capita outsourcing - BBC News
they are heavily in the brown smelly stuff (about half a billion loss last year, iirc). I'd be very wary of putting myself in a position where they potentially owed me any money right now.

they owe me a few grand for last week. The payment is already being processed as I've seen the remittance. It will arrive tomorrow. I can cope with that level of exposure.
Actually their share price went up as they announced the £500M loss. The price plummeted when they hit the shareholders with a stock dilution. They're not going anywhere for a while. In fact they're probably a better buy than Bitcoins for the next few months.

[Mordac]

Capita payment is really good. Weekly. 30 days sounds slow but I reckon OP has been given disinformation. I reckon that payment for June will be in July not august and the tool he spoke to knows **** all.

For how long? Thanks to lots of headlines like this:
Patients 'could have been harmed' after Capita outsourcing - BBC News
they are heavily in the brown smelly stuff (about half a billion loss last year, iirc). I'd be very wary of putting myself in a position where they potentially owed me any money right now.

[Jog On]

Blockchain.

Surely there's an ICO to be had out of this

[WTFH]

My agency pays the money out as soon as it receives it and has always operated this way for the life of my three contracts I have taken in the public sector through them.

If your agent is good, are they using FPS, in which case payment will be in seconds, not overnight.

Now, what about my other question:

If the timesheet was signed off on 26th, 27th or 28th June, would payment also be 27th July?

[original PM]

I will still be paid weekly, it will just be delayed by almost 5 weeks. My agency pays the money out as soon as it receives it and has always operated this way for the life of my three contracts I have taken in the public sector through them. I would just like to know why it takes AMS 33 days to pay someone, when Capita could do it in 5!


As to my spending patterns and finances, I think its none of your business, but thanks for the concern.

Because they can.

But also cash flow and investment - the longer the money is in their account the more they can earn on it - or if they were paying you before they get paid then they would be reducing their debt liabilities.

In terms of your finances - if you do see yourself as genuinely a company and have set one up then we can easily check up on companies house if we wanna see your accounts.

[Zigenare]

I will still be paid weekly, it will just be delayed by almost 5 weeks. My agency pays the money out as soon as it receives it and has always operated this way for the life of my three contracts I have taken in the public sector through them. I would just like to know why it takes AMS 33 days to pay someone, when Capita could do it in 5!


As to my spending patterns and finances, I think its none of your business, but thanks for the concern.

It may be something to do with the willingness to factor invoices.

[Geoff Gecko]

If the timesheet was signed off on 26th, 27th or 28th June, would payment also be 27th July?
Giving one date, adding up days and saying "it's 33 days" is not very scientific. It might be 30 days + the agent adding on 3 to pay you. It might be End of week 4, it might be 30 days.

Has the agent confirmed that they do next day bank transfers? It's quite common for them to be the ones using BACS which takes 3 days to clear.

If your finances are that tight that 28 days is OK, but 33 isn't, then you might need to re-think your career choice and spending patterns.

I will still be paid weekly, it will just be delayed by almost 5 weeks. My agency pays the money out as soon as it receives it and has always operated this way for the life of my three contracts I have taken in the public sector through them. I would just like to know why it takes AMS 33 days to pay someone, when Capita could do it in 5!


As to my spending patterns and finances, I think its none of your business, but thanks for the concern.

[Old Greg]

If you need or expect regular payments, go perm. Sorry.

Do you not do cashflow management or credit control? Sounds like you should go perm.

[WTFH]

Thanks for your input everyone.

I have gone back to my agency with some of the questions and they seem to be very open about it. They confirmed that if a timesheet is signed off by 25th June (for work completed 18-23rd June) at 1200, then it will take 33 days for payment to come through (27th July). It takes my agency 48 hours to process the payment over the weekend so my Umbrella wont receive the money until 30 July and then payment into my bank on the 31st July.

If the timesheet was signed off on 26th, 27th or 28th June, would payment also be 27th July?
Giving one date, adding up days and saying "it's 33 days" is not very scientific. It might be 30 days + the agent adding on 3 to pay you. It might be End of week 4, it might be 30 days.

Has the agent confirmed that they do next day bank transfers? It's quite common for them to be the ones using BACS which takes 3 days to clear.

If your finances are that tight that 28 days is OK, but 33 isn't, then you might need to re-think your career choice and spending patterns.

[Zigenare]

Thanks for your input everyone.

I have gone back to my agency with some of the questions and they seem to be very open about it. They confirmed that if a timesheet is signed off by 25th June (for work completed 18-23rd June) at 1200, then it will take 33 days for payment to come through (27th July). It takes my agency 48 hours to process the payment over the weekend so my Umbrella wont receive the money until 30 July and then payment into my bank on the 31st July.

What are the payment terms as detailed in your contract?

[Geoff Gecko]

Thanks for your input everyone.

I have gone back to my agency with some of the questions and they seem to be very open about it. They confirmed that if a timesheet is signed off by 25th June (for work completed 18-23rd June) at 1200, then it will take 33 days for payment to come through (27th July). It takes my agency 48 hours to process the payment over the weekend so my Umbrella wont receive the money until 30 July and then payment into my bank on the 31st July.

[Lockhouse]

If you need or expect regular payments, go perm. Sorry.

[MrButton]

What others said 33 day terms weekly isn’t that bad.

Maybe the agent meant you’ll have had a full months payment by August? Ask them?

Agreed capita weekly payments with 7 day terms is good. Will see what happens when AMS takes over the existing contracts.

I’d be surprised if there wasn’t a clause that taking over the contract they would honour current arrangements agreed with capita?