Reply to: So much confusion

[NigelJK]

Scotland voted to remain

Did they have a different ballot paper in Scotland then?

[SpontaneousOrder]

All day yesterday we've been trying to make rational sense of the news without success. Our family is broken and our way life we've taken for granted pulled out from under our feet. Just profound sadness. I still can't quite believe it that the UK fell for the absurdities spouted from the likes of Farage, Johnson and Gove.

I'm lucky to be living in the EU but my heart goes out to all my friends and family that will now suffer in Scotland and indeed in the rest of the U.K. as a result of a weak prime minister who abdicated his elected responsibilities and asked a largely uninformed and misled nation to make this choice for him.

What a pansy.

Yesterday was glorious.

[VectraMan]

And while the EU flatly said this wouldn't happen in 2014, maybe they might be more amenable this time around - particularly if it means kicking England in the process.

There's no legal framework for this to happen, so it would need unanimous agreement from the other 27 countries. You still have the Spain/Catalonia issue, so that's still a big ask. But it's still worth a shot in the dark.

There's an important difference: IndyRef 1 was for no reason whatsoever, whereas there's a very good reason for IndyRef 2. They can't have people like Catalonia thinking they can call a referendum, get out of Spain but stay in the EU, but what's happening here is exceptional: a direct result of Brexit.

On the subject of the Euro there's entry criteria that obviously the UK has never been through. Would the EU waive that? Doesn't seem likely which means Scotland would need its own currency for a few years first. I think we've been here before. It's CUK 2014 all over again.

[scooterscot]

I think that is Sturgeon's game plan. To hold a referendum before the 2 years expires - on the basis that the EU would welcome Scotland as an independent country to keep the UK seat at the table, so it never left the EU and retains all the UK opt-outs...

Would be such a smart move. Fingers crossed.

[bobspud]

There is no feeling. The economy is more important. And access to the EU market facilitates that.

Actually being able to share the same currency opens up many interesting possibilities.

You are a financial retard... Why don't you ask a Greek man in the street about how having the Euro helped them

Aided by the fact that while Greece was being screwed into austerity everyone ignores the fact that France breaks the fiscal policy rules at will just because they are France.

[scooterscot]

Especially on the matter of currency I think as Salmond kept insisting they'd keep the pound whilst nobody this side of the border felt they should. How do Scots feel about The Pound vs The Euro now?

There is no feeling. The economy is more important. And access to the EU market facilitates that.

Actually being able to share the same currency opens up many interesting possibilities.

[centurian]

I accept your invitation.

How about Scotland holds an referendum before Westminster activates article 50? In that instance it technically it never left the EU.

Ball's in your court.

I think that is Sturgeon's game plan. To hold a referendum before the 2 years expires - on the basis that the EU would welcome Scotland as an independent country to keep the UK seat at the table, so it never left the EU and retains all the UK opt-outs.

And while the EU flatly said this wouldn't happen in 2014, maybe they might be more amenable this time around - particularly if it means kicking England in the process.

There's no legal framework for this to happen, so it would need unanimous agreement from the other 27 countries. You still have the Spain/Catalonia issue, so that's still a big ask. But it's still worth a shot in the dark.

A risky play though - threatens to make a precarious situation much, much worse.

[VectraMan]

The key reason for losing the last referendum was the rather muddled message on what would happen and the fear they might even not get into the EU. Having already negotiated this there would be a clear direction.

Especially on the matter of currency I think as Salmond kept insisting they'd keep the pound whilst nobody this side of the border felt they should. How do Scots feel about The Pound vs The Euro now?

[scooterscot]

I won't have to, I already have an EU passport :-)

Oh snap!

[meridian]

Just wait until you're standing in the 'all other passports' queue when travelling within the EU. You'll understand one of the many issues first hand.

I won't have to, I already have an EU passport :-)

[scooterscot]

Why would freedom of movement to Scotland be an issue? Are similar countries (Ireland, for instance) complaining about benefit tourists? Do they have "tent cities"? Of course not - people migrate to where there is work, very few do so to intentionally live off benefits.

Just wait until we're standing in the 'all other passports' queue when travelling within the EU. Understanding the issues first hand will become very real all of a sudden.

[scooterscot]

The way I see it negotiations would begin now with Scotland....

I hope for as much.

Re-mortgage my Edinburgh pad in Euros

[meridian]

Yep, you are quite correct. On the basis that we could still be in the EU for the next 2 or 10 years with all the hoops to go through, this well may then be the case. And a lot of finance companies already have offices in scotland around the glasgow and stirling areas.

I would still imagine when the EU and the remaining parts of the uk finally leave, then scotland would still need (and i imagine want) to become its own fully fledged member rather than sitting in a pre UK shadow.

But, i still think freedom of movement will be a problem for scotland in the long run.

Why would freedom of movement to Scotland be an issue? Are similar countries (Ireland, for instance) complaining about benefit tourists? Do they have "tent cities"? Of course not - people migrate to where there is work, very few do so to intentionally live off benefits.

[BlasterBates]

The way I see it negotiations would begin now with Scotland and I can imagine the EU will be disposed to negotiate even though Scotland isn't fully independent after all it has it's own Government. The point is they can hammer out an agreement provisional on independence.

The key reason for losing the last referendum was the rather muddled message on what would happen and the fear they might even not get into the EU. Having already negotiated this there would be a clear direction. Given the alternative of being governed by some swivel-eyed loons South of the border, who think they can dictate one-sided trade agreements to trading partners far bigger and powerful than they are, it'll probably be a no-brainer.

[scooterscot]

Ode to joy?

Snow patrol - chasing cars

Not quite at this level, not far off either.