Reply to: I'm back people and with a new parking zone

[OrangeHopper]

How do we know this the original roger rabbit?

Stockbridge : Half way point on a regular trip I do. Somewhere that I can take a break and fondle some expensive fly rods.

[chef]

You did this to trap me didn't you? After my last week's post of a ten year old news story.

old but not quite senile yet eh Xog

[xoggoth]

You did this to trap me didn't you? After my last week's post of a ten year old news story.

[EternalOptimist]

bored

bored eh ?

well I've got one for you

[chef]

You going for some sort of Necro-bump record Chef?

bored

[DaveB]

welcome back RR

You going for some sort of Necro-bump record Chef?

[sasguru]

welcome back RR

2006 called. They want their sockie back.

HTH, but IDI

[chef]

welcome back RR

[expat]

No - Siberia is not the same as Asia: those troops were so bad, they would often not even speak Russian

Shame on them!

and understand what to do, they'd just run away

Shocking. They shouldn't have volunteered then. Oh, wait....






I'l spell it out: if an invading army conscripts you to fight and die in one of its wars elsewhere, it is neither treason not cowardice to run away from that.

[AtW]

The Siberian troops were recruited from Asiatic Russia... doh!

No - Siberia is not the same as Asia: those troops were so bad, they would often not even speak Russian and understand what to do, they'd just run away, complete waste of effort.

Siberian divisions were made of Russian people who moved to live in Siberia, either voluntarily or by force (more common), since conditions were very harsh there this made them pretty good troops during winter periods.

Say a lot of snipers that win Olympic games (biatlon and all that crap) come from my region of West Siberia - some of the largest snipers schools located there because traditionally Siberian hunters were very accurate - they had to shoot squirrel into an eye to avoid damaging fur.

[mcquiggd]

The Siberian troops were recruited from Asiatic Russia... doh!

[AtW]

What asiatic troops? German attack on Moscow was saved by Siberian troops - there has always been plenty of manpower in Russia, even though Stalin did a lot to reduce it big time, but still to lose million soldiers (good 70 divisions) for Russia is usual thing, where as for any country other than China it is a complete disaster.

[mcquiggd]

Is that why the Russians turned to Asiatic troops to turn the tide, mmm...?

[AtW]

Germans had high level of team work and general strategy, their units were also of high quality, but quality can be undone by quantity, much like outsourcing

[mcquiggd]

Same as Tiger (though Jagdpanther was better suited for this role due to lower profile and better armour) - manual for Tigers explicitly said to use them from long distances.

Once again, Wittman fought on many fronts, including the Russian. If he had stayed there, he probably would have had the same sort of kill ratio against Russian opponents as the Luftwaffe Aces, for example.

Earlier you mentioned a JagdTiger - basically a mobile wall of solid armour with a fecking big 88mm L71 poking out of it. Then a JagdPanther, which is only marginally less scary.... but probably better designed, due to a solid, sloping armour frontage. As you say, both were fearsome weapons to face when attacking - but, the big difference is, Wittman didn't use thse big standoff weapons, he used tactics, and got in close...

Rudel was probably his equivalent - in terms of tank busting pilots...I believe he is even credited with a very large Armoured Cruiser.


A frightening scenario - all else being equal - face Otto Skorzeny, Jochen Pieper, Michael Witmann, and Hans-Ulrich Rudel, in their 'weapons of choice'... with Erich Hartmann and his gang provding air cover... (the Ace credited with the most kills - 352 - mostly against Russians).