Reply to: Tech Mahindra - contracting through them

[Tedster]

Currently working on a contract for TM - it is a bit of pain getting paid by them (they refuse to use the clients portal because it isn't secure, so I have to snapshot my approved timesheets and send it to them via email)

The client is currently ONshoring a great raft of its legacy work so I'm quite confident I wont be getting replaced by one of the Needful Gang.I am actually replacing an 'bestshore resource )

I'd rather not work for them (having been made redundant by offshoring in the past) but if its the right job and the right money, you have to bite the bullet

[piningforthefjords]

You've just got to play the game. I've worked with them once. They will have an onsite manager and as a contractor your first task will be to establish a good rapport with him/her. Go to lunch with him or do him a favour. Once you've done that, you've won half the battle. Piss him/her off - your life is going to be difficult.

Tech Mahindra = Politics and bureaucracy. At the end of day, you just want your contract to go on for some time and make money right? Know and accept that they will try and replace you with their own resource at some point. Once you've made your peace with that, you can start to enjoy the role.

Yep, all good advice, thanks. Been in the game long enough to know how it works, but as I said, first time contracting through these guys. I will keep you all posted. Cheers.

[texto]

In terms of working practices you are their complete bitch and IR35 is blown out of the water. They micro manage, falsify client time sheets without you knowing, are very political and will manipulate you anyway they can. Of the guys I sit with, all are p1ssed off with TechM and that includes white British, Indian British and Indian nationals ( contractors and permies)

TechM are currently refusing to sign time sheets for one guy until he does something they want which he disagrees with.

You've just got to play the game. I've worked with them once. They will have an onsite manager and as a contractor your first task will be to establish a good rapport with him/her. Go to lunch with him or do him a favour. Once you've done that, you've won half the battle. Piss him/her off - your life is going to be difficult.

Tech Mahindra = Politics and bureaucracy. At the end of day, you just want your contract to go on for some time and make money right? Know and accept that they will try and replace you with their own resource at some point. Once you've made your peace with that, you can start to enjoy the role.

[tomtomagain]

I guess this is why the system is so crap.

Client manager reduces cost from £350/day to £120/day. Gets promotion for saving the company money.

Offshore company pockets £120/day gives lot less to workers. They make a profit.

Indian worker is used to getting treated like tulipe and isnt bothered by low wage. Hes happy.

Everyone in the chain happy until they realise the service is tulipe but its too late then. Cheap seems to trump quality in all things these days.

.... ah but you forgot that the extra £220 per day saved by the company is initially paid out as profit ( shareholders happy ) but then as things start to fail more resources are brought on.

And then more roles are created within the client organisation to manage the offshore service provider.

So although the initial head count is saved it is soon replaced by people with "Manager" in their job title. Aka "Release Manager", "Transition Manager", "Business Liaison Manager", "Infrastructure", "Test", "Project" and so on.

Most of these people "Face off" to an equivalent within the service provider and soon everyone spends their days in meetings.

Eventually the client company is unable to make rapid changes to their systems ( as they no longer own or understand them ) and get fleeced by everyone within the organisation. Management structures are self-preserving.

What eventually happens is a young, small, upstart company pops up and eats their lunch.

[psychocandy]

They charge the client fully and pay peanuts to the guys they bring from offshore. The offshore guys will have their salaries paid in Indian money which will be in the range of £500-£1000 a month and will get a small allowance here for around £800-£1200 per month along with a free shared accommodation, They have their office near where I live and I have seen around 4-6 guys crammed into a two bed apartment


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I guess this is why the system is so crap.

Client manager reduces cost from £350/day to £120/day. Gets promotion for saving the company money.

Offshore company pockets £120/day gives lot less to workers. They make a profit.

Indian worker is used to getting treated like tulipe and isnt bothered by low wage. Hes happy.

Everyone in the chain happy until they realise the service is tulipe but its too late then. Cheap seems to trump quality in all things these days.

[Eirikur]

I'd rather go on the dole permanently than consider TM

+1

[MicrosoftBob]

I'd rather go on the dole permanently than consider TM

[JoJoGabor]

I don't work for techM but am dealing with them and their contractors extensively at current client and reviewed an ex-colleagues contract for him last week who was brought on. The contract now is fairly robust for IR35, got the usual clauses in but some nasty ones around expenses and some other bits I can't remember.

In terms of working practices you are their complete bitch and IR35 is blown out of the water. They micro manage, falsify client time sheets without you knowing, are very political and will manipulate you anyway they can. Of the guys I sit with, all are p1ssed off with TechM and that includes white British, Indian British and Indian nationals ( contractors and permies)

TechM are currently refusing to sign time sheets for one guy until he does something they want which he disagrees with.

[nemosdad]

Always wondered what the offshore resources are costing. Based on 5-10 x then I guess we're possibly looking as low as £30-£40 a day. Really?

They charge the client fully and pay peanuts to the guys they bring from offshore. The offshore guys will have their salaries paid in Indian money which will be in the range of £500-£1000 a month and will get a small allowance here for around £800-£1200 per month along with a free shared accommodation, They have their office near where I live and I have seen around 4-6 guys crammed into a two bed apartment


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[ChimpMaster]

£350 up for onshore, £120 up or offshore. Don't be fooled by what they pay their workers.

So it's all a game where someone is benefitting through a brown paper envelope filled with rupees... or dollars, seeing as that is the preferred currency out there.

But we all know that because most deals such as these are driven not by the drive to improve things but rather by the bribes that can benefit those in (supposed) power. It was obvious at the bank where I was contracted: the on/off shoring of Indian resources resulted in a substantial degradation in service quality coupled with overall rise in cost (resources, getting the work done etc).

I wouldn't mind if such resources were any good at their job, or at least able to provide a fair service for the price paid. But no, we were swapped out for Monkeys being paid high-grade peanuts.

[mrdonuts]

its a possibility they just want your cv so they can suck out possible targets for offshoring

[malvolio]

That's my guess. I was told a few years ago but forgot the exact numbers... a banking client was fooled by offshore proposals and in the end they had a team of 4 or 5 offshore guys to replace me. Not sure how that worked out for them - but certainly couldn't have been financially or technically beneficial.

£350 up for onshore, £120 up or offshore. Don't be fooled by what they pay their workers.

[ChimpMaster]

Always wondered what the offshore resources are costing. Based on 5-10 x then I guess we're possibly looking as low as £30-£40 a day. Really?

That's my guess. I was told a few years ago but forgot the exact numbers... a banking client was fooled by offshore proposals and in the end they had a team of 4 or 5 offshore guys to replace me. Not sure how that worked out for them - but certainly couldn't have been financially or technically beneficial.

[psychocandy]

That's the case. They will do this as soon as possible because you are probably costing them something like 5 to 10 times what they would pay an offshore resource.

If the end-client really wants you to stay then you should contract with them directly and not have to report into Tech M. That way you wouldn't feel like you were being anally probed for your valuable knowledge every minute.

Otherwise go find a contract elsewhere - if the opportunity is there I mean.

Always wondered what the offshore resources are costing. Based on 5-10 x then I guess we're possibly looking as low as £30-£40 a day. Really?

[ChimpMaster]

I've worked through them once. They used to have a British HR person to deal with contractors. But not now - all agents are of Indian origin. I've not had any problems with payments - all were on time. But their process is very bureaucratic. For e.g. it took me ages to get contract terms changed for IR35. They will normally have an onsite manager who manages all their employees and contractors. If you get them on your side and establish rapport, it is plain sailing and you can get rate increase later on.
At some point they will try to replace you with a cheaper off shore (they normally have a rotating policy) - so expect to do some knowledge transfer.

That's the case. They will do this as soon as possible because you are probably costing them something like 5 to 10 times what they would pay an offshore resource.

If the end-client really wants you to stay then you should contract with them directly and not have to report into Tech M. That way you wouldn't feel like you were being anally probed for your valuable knowledge every minute.

Otherwise go find a contract elsewhere - if the opportunity is there I mean.