Reply to: Strategies for Handling a heavy workload in a small team

[psychocandy]

A 7.5 working day is totally culturally specific to the UK... even in the UK many jobs run 40 hour weeks but elsewhere 35 or 32 are the norm. You have to show flexibility, you're there to get the work done, not work a fixed number of hours.

Yeh. Agreed. Be flexible if and when required like occasionally if something goes wrong or something needs doing urgently (but then I expect same flexibility in return).

But what OP is describing is a blatant under resourcing and the client taking the piss and trying to get extras fro free.

[psychocandy]

The term professional working day in my mind is 7.5 hours with added flexibility of say 3 more hours in a week when required.

Beyond that I would be out the door as there are other things I need to do in my life (living it is one of them).

EXACTLY. My life is WAY more important than the clients issues.

[psychocandy]

The term professional day applies. An hour extra is not taking the pee really, but is the limit I'd draw... for many that's a normal working day anyway.

You could say you'll work more for overtime but you might not want to do that anyway.

OP is working almost 9 hours EVERY day. Its the EVERY thing that is an issue for me.

[jmo21]

A 7.5 working day is totally culturally specific to the UK... even in the UK many jobs run 40 hour weeks but elsewhere 35 or 32 are the norm. You have to show flexibility, you're there to get the work done, not work a fixed number of hours.

A line has to be drawn somewhere.

For me, the line is 7.5 hours per day, or slightly more if I have agreed up front.

On occasion, I will work extra without worrying about getting paid extra. If it is my **** up, I definitely will fix it by working extra.

As soon as it becomes the norm, they are taking the piss. They are trying to get more out of you than the price quoted.

If they tell me up front at interview, yep, we'll pay you X and we expect you to work 9 hour days, it is up to me to agree.

I can't picture any scenario where I'd agree to that short of doubling my normal rates.

[d000hg]

A 7.5 working day is totally culturally specific to the UK... even in the UK many jobs run 40 hour weeks but elsewhere 35 or 32 are the norm. You have to show flexibility, you're there to get the work done, not work a fixed number of hours.

[eek]

The term professional day applies. An hour extra is not taking the pee really, but is the limit I'd draw... for many that's a normal working day anyway.

You could say you'll work more for overtime but you might not want to do that anyway.

The term professional working day in my mind is 7.5 hours with added flexibility of say 3 more hours in a week when required.

Beyond that I would be out the door as there are other things I need to do in my life (living it is one of them).

[d000hg]

The term professional day applies. An hour extra is not taking the pee really, but is the limit I'd draw... for many that's a normal working day anyway.

You could say you'll work more for overtime but you might not want to do that anyway.

[psychocandy]

Well I'm telling the truth anyway LOL.
Thanks for all the replies, the response on here to problems is so impressive.
I am working typically 8.30 to 6.15 with an hour for lunch. Every 6 weeks I'm on 'Rota' monitoring the end of day (batch) so more like 9 to 8.30 with a 2nd meal break of about 1/2 hr.
Colleague is similar.
Team leader working more like 9-9 every day, sometimes 9-11.

I am getting some data from a former colleague tomorrow in a similar set up where they are properly resourced.
Then we all plan to sit down with the PM to discuss what we can do now, what the other team in former co. is able to do by comparison and then effectively say - your call...
I'd love to do the head in a bucket but I'm still 10 years odd from retirement - so something to look forward to in 2022ish!

Xux,

Fair does you sounds like a conscientious guy but, mate, their taking the piss.

Your doing by my calcs almost an hour extra pretty much every day. Dont get me wrong I will work extra now and again but not every day like this.

As for the late thing, yeh, I'd do it but that day you'd see me arrive in the office at midday.

What do you think would happen if you did this out of interest? i.e. left at 5-30pm or strolled in at 12pm?

[xux42]

Of course lots of teams exist like this.

We are assuming this guy is a professional and telling the truth, otherwise why would he post asking for suggestions?

Well I'm telling the truth anyway LOL.
Thanks for all the replies, the response on here to problems is so impressive.
I am working typically 8.30 to 6.15 with an hour for lunch. Every 6 weeks I'm on 'Rota' monitoring the end of day (batch) so more like 9 to 8.30 with a 2nd meal break of about 1/2 hr.
Colleague is similar.
Team leader working more like 9-9 every day, sometimes 9-11.

I am getting some data from a former colleague tomorrow in a similar set up where they are properly resourced.
Then we all plan to sit down with the PM to discuss what we can do now, what the other team in former co. is able to do by comparison and then effectively say - your call...
I'd love to do the head in a bucket but I'm still 10 years odd from retirement - so something to look forward to in 2022ish!

[jmo21]

More than likely but ITS HIS PROBLEM NOT OP'S

It is the managers problem, but he HAS made it the OP's problem in that the OP is posting here looking for advice, facing working long hours, or potentially leaving for a new role.

I'm not saying the manager is right, but seems to me that is what is happening. He risks losing people, but maybe that is a lesser problem for him.

[d000hg]

You may be surprised to know that you are not the only one who has to deal with almost the exact situation. This a classic example of poor management of human resources and money. PM who suppose to translate technical requirements and deadlines and pass to top management , fails to do that because of incompetency.

Move on ... until then; keep on invoicing....

It's not automatically the PM who is incompetent... he may also be in an intractable position. Often the client will simply refuse to spend more, and refuse to accept less. It's easy to find someone to blame.

[psychocandy]

1) Lots of people suggesting answers for 1, but frankly, unless he is a total idiot, he knows fine well that you need more resources. He either has no budget, or thinks he can screw you into working more hours to save his budget.

More than likely but ITS HIS PROBLEM NOT OP'S

[jmo21]

Aha! Then the upside is that he looks good, the downside is that you work more. Probably looks good from his side.

erm.... obviously.

[expat]

1) Lots of people suggesting answers for 1, but frankly, unless he is a total idiot, he knows fine well that you need more resources. He either has no budget, or thinks he can screw you into working more hours to save his budget.

Aha! Then the upside is that he looks good, the downside is that you work more. Probably looks good from his side.

[jmo21]

I work with teams who cant do any more, who tells people they are working their socks off. They go home on the dot of 5, have an hour lunch break when its supposed to be half an hour, and always have time to chat about any subject for an hour.

Of course lots of teams exist like this.

We are assuming this guy is a professional and telling the truth, otherwise why would he post asking for suggestions?