Front Office Roles?

[BS1397]

It is the same as most jobs, there are difficult parts and there are easy parts. You tend to be quite low in the food chain and have little authority, the adminisphere loves the traders as they make money for the bank so they are able to throw their weight about (hence the reputation for being like toddlers) and management will back them. A standard scenario would be:

Trader: We need to be able to see the different trade types in different colours. Can you do that by tomorrow?
Programmer: I doubt it, that is actually quite awkward.
Trader: Well if you don't it is going to make trading difficult and the bank will lose money.
*puff of smoke and a manager appears due to the incantation of 'lose money'*
Manager: Hey programmer, what is all this about you not supporting the trade desk? What do you think your job is?
Programmer: Where the hell did you come from? Why the hell has that smoke not set alarms off? Anyway, all I said was that it might not be doable by tomorrow.
Manager: I have no idea how to program or what the feature requested was but I am sure it can be done by tomorrow by any programmer good enough to still be working here tomorrow. Are we clear?
Programmer: *sigh*

Oh you had me laughing in stitches... All I can see is a Dilbert Cartoon with your storyline... Excellent stuff...

[MyUserName]

They are similar to any other job with a real time system. Sometimes something goes wrong and you have to get in there, we used to have an on call rota for that but sometimes you got a call anyway.

There are issues that can be caused by you being seen as assistants to the traders who are the golden boys but most jobs have potential issues.

Back office is probably easier to get into because there is, usually, less finance knowledge requested (often there is hardly any actually required). Some people move to the front office as there is often more money but competition is pretty fierce.

Unless you are a quant in which case it seems like you can pretty much breeze in, a few months ago I saw quant positions at £1000 a day. However, being a quant is a horrible sacrifice to make for money - apart from at BNPP where one of the quant girls was a goth girl in her mid twenties with tatoos who was absolutely stunning.

[Scrag Meister]

I've done both MO and FO and not had any real knobs in any of them.

As has been said there is the occasional issue that is a tad insane but they have been rare in my experience.

[Den]

Is it easier to get into Front Office after getting Back/Middle Office experience for dev guys? Also what is better HFs or IBs?

[Lewis]

I have worked in a lot of FO places (Non-U.S) where the environment is busy but quiet and calm.

I agree. I've been in Front Office roles for the best part of the last 10 years and I find it perfectly fine. No undue stress, no long hours etc.. You get the odd incident but nothing major. Even working on the trading floor is ok, it's a bit noisy at times but a perfectly 'normal' working environment, i.e. you're not being shouted at by petulent traders etc..

EDIT - and yes actually when I think about it all the incidents were at U.S. IBs.

[DaveB]

In the dim and distant past I did a stint at JP Morgan doing FO tech support. This was back in the days when Sun Workstations used optical mice that needed a special shiney mouse pad to work. Any time things went wrong on the floor they were the first thing to get flung accross the room, followed by an angry call to the service desk complaining that their mouse didnt work anymore.

In the end we spent a weekend going around every trading desk sticking the things down with contact adhesive. At least we got overtime for it.

[Taita]

It is the same as most jobs, there are difficult parts and there are easy parts. You tend to be quite low in the food chain and have little authority, the adminisphere loves the traders as they make money for the bank so they are able to throw their weight about (hence the reputation for being like toddlers) and management will back them. A standard scenario would be:

Trader: We need to be able to see the different trade types in different colours. Can you do that by tomorrow?
Programmer: I doubt it, that is actually quite awkward.
Trader: Well if you don't it is going to make trading difficult and the bank will lose money.
*puff of smoke and a manager appears due to the incantation of 'lose money'*
Manager: Hey programmer, what is all this about you not supporting the trade desk? What do you think your job is?
Programmer: Where the hell did you come from? Why the hell has that smoke not set alarms off? Anyway, all I said was that it might not be doable by tomorrow.
Manager: I have no idea how to program or what the feature requested was but I am sure it can be done by tomorrow by any programmer good enough to still be working here tomorrow. Are we clear?
Programmer: *sigh*

What a wonderful answer especially for someone like me who has not encountered that sort of incompetent managerial mania in a very long time. I have been leading a sheltered life and will never complain again!

[MyUserName]

I was under the impression that front office roles were super stressful due to having to deal with traders, who're reputed to have a lower flashpoint than the average toddler.

It's not going to do me much good though, as the agent was adamant I wasn't going to go forward. I could phone him up again tomorrow.

It is the same as most jobs, there are difficult parts and there are easy parts. You tend to be quite low in the food chain and have little authority, the adminisphere loves the traders as they make money for the bank so they are able to throw their weight about (hence the reputation for being like toddlers) and management will back them. A standard scenario would be:

Trader: We need to be able to see the different trade types in different colours. Can you do that by tomorrow?
Programmer: I doubt it, that is actually quite awkward.
Trader: Well if you don't it is going to make trading difficult and the bank will lose money.
*puff of smoke and a manager appears due to the incantation of 'lose money'*
Manager: Hey programmer, what is all this about you not supporting the trade desk? What do you think your job is?
Programmer: Where the hell did you come from? Why the hell has that smoke not set alarms off? Anyway, all I said was that it might not be doable by tomorrow.
Manager: I have no idea how to program or what the feature requested was but I am sure it can be done by tomorrow by any programmer good enough to still be working here tomorrow. Are we clear?
Programmer: *sigh*

[Bluenose]

It's down to the agents imo and H.R depts being brain deaths.

It depends on the client, some places have deserved reputations. Personally, I would give any U.S Investment bank a wide birth.

There was a big shift in the City from 2004 onwards, alot of barrow boys got the push and were replaced with geeky quant types. Alot of the wide-boys ended up at Brokers, open out-cry, Retail or Barcap.

I have worked in a lot of FO places (Non-U.S) where the environment is busy but quiet and calm.

All this "got to have front office exp" malarky is BS.

[BrilloPad]

But I was curious to know whether front office roles are as difficult and stressful as they're reputed to be, or whether it's just agents being fussier than their end clients.

Depends on the role. IMO they are technically less challenging - but some users can be highly strung. The usual killer is the commuting though.

[Graemsay]

Thanks.

I was under the impression that front office roles were super stressful due to having to deal with traders, who're reputed to have a lower flashpoint than the average toddler.

It's not going to do me much good though, as the agent was adamant I wasn't going to go forward. I could phone him up again tomorrow.

[MyUserName]

Front office roles can be stressful as hades, I have a friend who is regularly there at 2am fixing things. I doubt they are all like that though.

[nomadd]

I was trawling Jobserve last night, and stumbled across a role at a trading house. What caught my eye was that they wanted to develop an Android app, and since I've spent most of the last year or so on that platform, figured it would be worth a shot.

I phoned the agent this morning, and was told that I was unsuitable because I'd never worked in a front office environment.

I've been a contractor long enough to know that it's a bit of a catch-22 getting into the financial sector. But I was curious to know whether front office roles are as difficult and stressful as they're reputed to be, or whether it's just agents being fussier than their end clients.

It's all hogwash, TBH.

My last two roles have been FO, but the previous ones to that were 14 years prior. I make it clear at the interviews that I'm a techie, not a "banking" person, but that still doesn't stop roles coming through - so in other words, the FO skills they think they are looking for aren't really necessary most of the time. And the stress comes from incompetent management, nothing specific to FO.

Mind you, you can't necessarily blame the agents: it's usually the clients who stipulate this kind of stupidity. Bit like the "must be SC cleared" roles that I can't get (most of which probably go to Bobs, because clearly they are most "secure" than me, a lifelong British Citizen )

[Graemsay]

I was trawling Jobserve last night, and stumbled across a role at a trading house. What caught my eye was that they wanted to develop an Android app, and since I've spent most of the last year or so on that platform, figured it would be worth a shot.

I phoned the agent this morning, and was told that I was unsuitable because I'd never worked in a front office environment.

I've been a contractor long enough to know that it's a bit of a catch-22 getting into the financial sector. But I was curious to know whether front office roles are as difficult and stressful as they're reputed to be, or whether it's just agents being fussier than their end clients.