Reply to: New trend?

[cojak]

I have deleted posts and would like to remind you of the code of behaviour in the professional forums.

http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...al-forums.html

[BolshieBastard]

Found the ad, it came on an email:

"Unix Systems Administrator to take on a contract
at a leading Retail Bank in Milton Keynes.

Role is 75% AIX based and 25% Solaris.

Candidates must understand that being on call will be required at weekends
aswell as during the week and therefore you must be willing to stay locally at
the weekends if you are not currently withing a reasonable distance of Milton
Keynes."

Admittedly, not saying local candidates only but near enough.

Have to say, that is not unreasonable IF you need to be on call regularly. However, the jobswerve advert didnt have that extra info in it. It just said local candidates preferred.

[The Agents View]

I think that's a load of bellwhiff personally!

Its more like agent want 'local' contractor as said agent knows 9 times out of 10, he can con the local contractor into taking a lower rate because its 'on his doorstep' and give him a bigger margin.

The number of times I've had agents say to me this job is very local to you so you wont have travel and or accommadation expenses, could you do it for a lower rate, is quite common.

You're actually the least informed member of this board. Recruiters fight for their jobs every single day - it's enough to try and get any kind of deal done in this economic climate, without clueless idiots like you spouting off about it being the agent at fault. When a client asks for a local candidate, you don't argue, you find what they want.

Perhaps think about the reality of what you're writing before you write it..... For example, A recruitment consultant typically earns 10-15% of the profit margin that they generate. So when you talk about an agent tucking you up for £20, you're talking about risking £10 per day in the pocket of the agent, and gambling it to earn £12. I'd rather have £10 per day, £50 per week, £200 per month in commission, than a 50% drop out ratio because I've peeved the candidate off.

As for the final line - what utter rubbish....you think they're doing that to increase their margin? They're doing it to make you the stand out candidate - to make you the most realistic commercial proposition. <mod snip>

[SueEllen]

Found the ad, it came on an email:

"Unix Systems Administrator to take on a contract
at a leading Retail Bank in Milton Keynes.

Role is 75% AIX based and 25% Solaris.

Candidates must understand that being on call will be required at weekends
aswell as during the week and therefore you must be willing to stay locally at
the weekends if you are not currently withing a reasonable distance of Milton
Keynes."

Admittedly, not saying local candidates only but near enough.

Probably had some numpties interview and not understand the fact that if they were on call they may have to come in quickly so being 100 miles away is no good.

[Scoobos]

Having historically been a contractor who searches world wide for a particular niche skillset and then moves to the area anyway(I don't have kids) - I'm not surprised by this.

In fact, I'm a bit pleased, it used to really grind my gears that agents would simply search CV's and linked in for people within the region anyway; at least they are being honest about it by doing this.

I know for a fact I got "put forward" (binned) for a gig because I wasn't within 50 miles of it, as I directly approached the client and got the gig myself - they were'nt bothered either.

I think its greedy agencies myself - who see you being more likely to renew and perhaps take a rate cut / margin hike, based on how close you are to the client site (or how tied in you are) - maybe I'm a skeptic.

[BigTime]

Surely that's fair enough then and not really what the the OP was referring to.

Found the ad, it came on an email:

"Unix Systems Administrator to take on a contract
at a leading Retail Bank in Milton Keynes.

Role is 75% AIX based and 25% Solaris.

Candidates must understand that being on call will be required at weekends
aswell as during the week and therefore you must be willing to stay locally at
the weekends if you are not currently withing a reasonable distance of Milton
Keynes."

Admittedly, not saying local candidates only but near enough.

[BolshieBastard]

The only problem I have with that is the bad English, it should be "commutable distance from..."

Take that up with the agent but oh come on (to use your words!), do you understand what he's asking or not?

Oh come on, this is public sector mentality! We live in a (kind of) free country. Why can't the employer be free to decide if they want a local person or not? They probably have had problems with workforce coming late or bad local public transport.

The whole premise of the contracting market is a flexible and moveable workforce. Clients \ agents stating local only candidates negates that.

So, I think you'll find it's your thinking that is more like 'public sector thinking'!

[petergriffin]

I've started seeing this quite frequency recently in job specs "The ideal candidate will live within a daily commutable distance of.........."

The only problem I have with that is the bad English, it should be "commutable distance from..."

Say what!? Since when has this been important in a job spec? Yes, I know they may want you to be at their beck and call, and even that seems like strong direction and control.

It is bordering on a new kind of discrimination, discriminating against candidates who arent local or within the 'commutable distance.'

Oh come on, this is public sector mentality! We live in a (kind of) free country. Why can't the employer be free to decide if they want a local person or not? They probably have had problems with workforce coming late or bad local public transport.

[dynamicsaxcontractor]

I think that's a load of bellwhiff personally!

Its more like agent want 'local' contractor as said agent knows 9 times out of 10, he can con the local contractor into taking a lower rate because its 'on his doorstep' and give him a bigger margin.

The number of times I've had agents say to me this job is very local to you so you wont have travel and or accommadation expenses, could you do it for a lower rate, is quite common.

Agents try any trick they can possible think of to rip us off.

[BolshieBastard]

This is all very simple really - and makes sound business sense if you think of it from the clients perspective. Imagine the scenario.

Northern Monkey, gets job at Cornwall Monkeys Inc. His daily rate's OK, he's got his accomodation paid for - it's all good. But Northern Monkey does miss Mrs Monkey a bit, and proper pie and gravy a lot....(or potentially Mrs Monkey has moved out, and Northern Monkey is paying his massive mortgage, for a house which is unlived in for 5 days out of 7). But it was the only thing going at the time, so Northern Monkey HAD to take it.

Then, 2 months later, Northern Monkey Lovers Incorporated rings up and says "I need this that and the other doing....I'll add £50 to your rate and give you the same length contract....fancy it?"

Lets be honest - everyone would be tempted - despite the fact that most contractors will do their best to avoid upsetting clients, quite regularly, they try even harder to look after themselves - and in this situation, it's all a bit too easy to say yes.

So Cornwall Monkeys have now spent 2 months paying a daily rate, have invested all of their IP into a contractor - who is going to up and leave because they picked up something closer to home. Half the budget's gone, and there's suddenly no time to bring anyone new up to speed.

Take someone local, and it's less likely to happen like that (although not impossible). It's not right necessarily, but in these risk averse, times of austerity, it is actually quite sensible when you think about it.

I think that's a load of bellwhiff personally!

Its more like agent want 'local' contractor as said agent knows 9 times out of 10, he can con the local contractor into taking a lower rate because its 'on his doorstep' and give him a bigger margin.

The number of times I've had agents say to me this job is very local to you so you wont have travel and or accommadation expenses, could you do it for a lower rate, is quite common.

[dynamicsaxcontractor]

This is all very simple really - and makes sound business sense if you think of it from the clients perspective. Imagine the scenario.

Northern Monkey, gets job at Cornwall Monkeys Inc. His daily rate's OK, he's got his accomodation paid for - it's all good. But Northern Monkey does miss Mrs Monkey a bit, and proper pie and gravy a lot....(or potentially Mrs Monkey has moved out, and Northern Monkey is paying his massive mortgage, for a house which is unlived in for 5 days out of 7). But it was the only thing going at the time, so Northern Monkey HAD to take it.

Then, 2 months later, Northern Monkey Lovers Incorporated rings up and says "I need this that and the other doing....I'll add £50 to your rate and give you the same length contract....fancy it?"

Lets be honest - everyone would be tempted - despite the fact that most contractors will do their best to avoid upsetting clients, quite regularly, they try even harder to look after themselves - and in this situation, it's all a bit too easy to say yes.

So Cornwall Monkeys have now spent 2 months paying a daily rate, have invested all of their IP into a contractor - who is going to up and leave because they picked up something closer to home. Half the budget's gone, and there's suddenly no time to bring anyone new up to speed.

Take someone local, and it's less likely to happen like that (although not impossible). It's not right necessarily, but in these risk averse, times of austerity, it is actually quite sensible when you think about it.

If Cornwall Monkeys would have agreed to Northern Monkey that he could WFH 2 days a week and given him a decent rate from the start this would never happen.

[The Agents View]

This is all very simple really - and makes sound business sense if you think of it from the clients perspective. Imagine the scenario.

Northern Monkey, gets job at Cornwall Monkeys Inc. His daily rate's OK, he's got his accomodation paid for - it's all good. But Northern Monkey does miss Mrs Monkey a bit, and proper pie and gravy a lot....(or potentially Mrs Monkey has moved out, and Northern Monkey is paying his massive mortgage, for a house which is unlived in for 5 days out of 7). But it was the only thing going at the time, so Northern Monkey HAD to take it.

Then, 2 months later, Northern Monkey Lovers Incorporated rings up and says "I need this that and the other doing....I'll add £50 to your rate and give you the same length contract....fancy it?"

Lets be honest - everyone would be tempted - despite the fact that most contractors will do their best to avoid upsetting clients, quite regularly, they try even harder to look after themselves - and in this situation, it's all a bit too easy to say yes.

So Cornwall Monkeys have now spent 2 months paying a daily rate, have invested all of their IP into a contractor - who is going to up and leave because they picked up something closer to home. Half the budget's gone, and there's suddenly no time to bring anyone new up to speed.

Take someone local, and it's less likely to happen like that (although not impossible). It's not right necessarily, but in these risk averse, times of austerity, it is actually quite sensible when you think about it.

[northernladuk]

Does that mean those of us who work all over the place should put our locations on our CVs?

Personally I don't put my location on, or where my clients are located especially with contracts where I work at a mixture of places including from home.

Not so sure where in my rant I indicated we should put locations? Locations for mine are on as it is pretty obvious where they are so don't have an issue but that is just me. To be honest I never really thought locations mattered a stuff but if this is the new trend maybe I ought to take your lead as well.

[SueEllen]

As I said in my first post I believe the raft of new 'contractors' that have been pushed in to this due to redundancy without understanding the full implications of it and are not willing to put the legwork in and see contracts through will make this a much more common occurance. I think the same will happen to notice periods and rates as this practice continues.

Does that mean those of us who work all over the place should put our locations on our CVs?

Personally I don't put my location on, or where my clients are located especially with contracts where I work at a mixture of places including from home.

[jmo21]

I saw one in the last week or so and it said you needed this. It went on to say due to being oncall you had to stay at the weekend too. If I see it again I'll post the link.

Surely that's fair enough then and not really what the the OP was referring to.