Agency worker regulations

[SueDon]

Councils flag all no-perm workers as in scope of AWR

The AWR are tulipe. There's no way professional contractors, whatever the sphere they work in, should be 'caught' by these.

Comensura who run the "HR" function for a number of local authorities has put all those who are not on the perminant payroll as in-scope pof AWR.

I am doing some work at a London authority and certainly everyone has been flagged, they are trying to pay holiday money.

Being in reciept of such "benefits" is likely to mean that we'll get caught by IR35.

[Avro]

I have not made any enquiries with the ClientCo as of yet but will do if a renewal is offered.

[SueEllen]

My agency were contacting all contractors that they have onsite with this ClientCo that are currently using an umbrella. All I have been told is that the ClientCo is insisting on all new contracts being engaged through a Ltd due to AWR and that it may also affect existing contracts.

Have you actually spoken to the people who deal with contractor procurement at clientCo about this?

As firstly there are some umbrella companies with compliant solutions and secondly the agency could simply be lying.

If you find out they are lying you can easily get the agency in trouble.

[northernladuk]

Trouble is, what's the definition of 'professional contractor'

How on earth should we know???!! oh... erm.. forget that...

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

The AWR are tulipe. There's no way professional contractors, whatever the sphere they work in, should be 'caught' by these.

I dont want the same conditions as permies after, 12, 26, 52 or however how many weeks. If I want permie conditons, I'll go ******* permie! But I have no intention of doing that. I'll retire first!

Trouble is, what's the definition of 'professional contractor'

[BolshieBastard]

The AWR are tulipe. There's no way professional contractors, whatever the sphere they work in, should be 'caught' by these.

I dont want the same conditions as permies after, 12, 26, 52 or however how many weeks. If I want permie conditons, I'll go ******* permie! But I have no intention of doing that. I'll retire first!

[Avro]

My agency were contacting all contractors that they have onsite with this ClientCo that are currently using an umbrella. All I have been told is that the ClientCo is insisting on all new contracts being engaged through a Ltd due to AWR and that it may also affect existing contracts.

I discussed this with another umbrella using contractor this morning, and at the moment he has not heard anything of this from his agency. So it is always possible that it is my agency calling the shots rather than the ClientCo.

Its about 3 months until the end of my current contract, so I will look into this further to have a more informed discussion if an extension is offered. I am not averse to using a Ltd (I have done in the past).

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

Well done Mal Only one teeny tiny little thing - a good outside IR35 contract with a recruitment agency will not limit clients' control unless the terms are mirrored in the contract between the agency and the client. The big IR35 cases have been lost because this point was not considered.

[malvolio]

We're suffering from poor wording here. The Regs are not intended to catch what you and I would see as freelance contractors working through Ltd Cos, but they haven't actually said that. In order to stop employers pushing employees into setting put their own companies - something that happens a lot with hotel cleaners, for example... - they left in the the qualitfication about "under the direction and control of the client". So since a good outside-IR35 contract usually limits the client's level of Control, it would put you outside the AWR. However it is not enough to say "I work through a Ltd so I'm outside the scope", you actually have to be independent. For umbrella users that makes things just a little tricky, since you don't normally have to worry about IR35 pointers (else why use a brolly?).

There's a detail write up on the PCG website with some extra materials to shut the agencies up. One thing you can't do is opt out of the AWR or declare yourself outside its scope: it's all about being genuinely independent.


@Lisa - yes, I know. I've been doing some deeper research

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

Hi I am a long term lurker on the forum and this is my first post....

I had a call from my agency this week to advise that the current ClientCo (A well known retail bank) will require all new contractors to be using a limited company in relation to AWR. The agency are waiting to be advised about existing contracts but are currently assuming that they will wait until next renewal.

Have they advised why Avro??

[Avro]

Hi I am a long term lurker on the forum and this is my first post....

I had a call from my agency this week to advise that the current ClientCo (A well known retail bank) will require all new contractors to be using a limited company in relation to AWR. The agency are waiting to be advised about existing contracts but are currently assuming that they will wait until next renewal.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

Basically, if your working practises mean that you operate outside IR35 then it is likely that you will fall outside the scope of the AWR and therefore they will not affect you. Just working through a Limited Company will not put anyone outside scope of the regulations; if they are within IR35, they will be inside scope of the AWR.

HTH

[rickom]

Hello!

I have been trying to understand what AWR is and how does this affect me.

From the article here;

The legislation will give temporary agency workers the same basic rights, after 12 weeks in the same assignment, as those on permanent contracts of employment in a comparable role.

Which i assume is not good from the IR35 perspective or am I just taking bollocks here ?

My contract reading:

"the Personnel is not an agency worker as defined under AWR Legislation and that the AWR Legislation does not apply in relation to this Agreement or any Assignment under this Agreement."

All in all , i am a little inundated by the information i have been reading up on. From my contractual review, it falls outside IR35. Which brings me to the below :


Outside IR35 and Out of Scope AWR

In these cases it is likely that the hirer will insist on engaging workers who operate through their own limited companies as this will save money. This has no MSC risk to recruiters.

It may be good for clients, but does this throw a dime in my favour?

Sorry If I seem a little vague, i am trying to wrap my head around this stuff.

Cheers!
Haresh