Switch agencies *after* interview, before signing contract...

[Lance]

Which brings me to my next question!

I've read the threads where agency has quoted day rate as Inc. VAT and understand that it's them trying it on, but when I read those it seemed to be that it was there in black and white saying £xxx Inc VAT. The contract I have seems to have two conflicting wordings. In a definition section at the start it states: "Fees" include agreed Fees, any expenses authorised by the client and VAT charged at the applicable rate. So chopping out all the extraneous wording in between I read the sentence as "Fees" include fees and VAT. The schedule states the "Fees" as £xxx per day and the bottom has an asterisk stating fees are plus VAT if applicable.

To my non-lawyer mind these are conflicting? On the one hand they define fees as Including VAT and then later on say they are Excluding. I've gone back to them asking them to clarify the statement but just wondered if this is them pulling a trick or this is a usual thing?

sounds like you have a normal contract.
You charge £x00 per day + VAT
expenses are £xxx + VAT
that's how I read it. Ignore the threads that say some try it on. Yours says plus VAT so all prices are excluding VAT.

[Yorga]

Overall they've pegged you as a newbie so they are going to pull every trick on you they can I am afraid.

Which brings me to my next question!

I've read the threads where agency has quoted day rate as Inc. VAT and understand that it's them trying it on, but when I read those it seemed to be that it was there in black and white saying £xxx Inc VAT. The contract I have seems to have two conflicting wordings. In a definition section at the start it states: "Fees" include agreed Fees, any expenses authorised by the client and VAT charged at the applicable rate. So chopping out all the extraneous wording in between I read the sentence as "Fees" include fees and VAT. The schedule states the "Fees" as £xxx per day and the bottom has an asterisk stating fees are plus VAT if applicable.

To my non-lawyer mind these are conflicting? On the one hand they define fees as Including VAT and then later on say they are Excluding. I've gone back to them asking them to clarify the statement but just wondered if this is them pulling a trick or this is a usual thing?

[LondonManc]

You've had a welcome pack from the client. Phone them and tell them you're looking forward to starting on Monday if that suits them, but you've been waiting for the paperwork from the agency. Could they give the agency a nudge.

This, this and thrice this.

Be polite, enthusiastic and don't slag off the agency at all.

[northernladuk]

QDOS can turn around an IR35 check in a day if you pay a bit more so you shouldn't normally need to delay the start date.

Not sure why it strikes you as odd though. Client is expecting you there and agent works in daily commission so pretty obvious why they aren't happy about it.

Overall they've pegged you as a newbie so they are going to pull every trick on you they can I am afraid.

[Yorga]

I have the contract now and it's going through an IR35 check at the moment so it's a bit of a moot point now but thanks for all your input. It felt like they were with-holding the contract until the last minute, I've been asking since last Friday and it only arrived after lunch yesterday and this is about 3 weeks since initial contact. The plot thickens: I suggested delaying start date to give time to sort through the contract, make any revisions, have it rechecked etc and they flat out refused which struck me as odd.

2) if I thought the agency weren't actually going to put my CV forward and just wanted me off the market.

Is this a thing? It's been a steep learning curve this last week that's for sure, I just asssumed everyone was nice and friendly and looking out for my best interests LOL

[Lance]

The only time I'd allow more than one agency to represent me for the same client is if ...

1) one of the agencies refused to disclose who the client is. You can sometimes work it out but if they don't tell you you can't know for sure. IMO this is agencies being muppets to themselves.
2) if I thought the agency weren't actually going to put my CV forward and just wanted me off the market.

I've done #1, or at least thought I had. Difficult to know for sure.
I've never done #2 but wished I had as I found out two years later, when I got the same role as it became available, that my CV was never submitted.

[Old Greg]

Apologies if this is covered elsewhere, I've searched and can only find posts about switching agencies at renewal time rather than this situation.

I applied for a couple of job ads without knowing 100% they were the same role through different agencies . Agency1 called and I agreed they could represent. Agency2 called next day and after going through all the usuals it became apparent that it was the same job as I had discussed with Agency1 so I said thanks I'm already being represented. Had a phone interview with client and received an offer the next day which I said I would accept (and here is where I made Newbie Mistake Number 1 - I was offered an interview for a different role which I turned down on the basis I had "accepted" a role......)

This is first contract so went through the rigmarole of creating Ltd., accountant etc. I've had a welcome pack .doc from the client explaining everything and they are expecting me to start soon. The only fly in the ointment is I still haven't had the contract through from Agency1. It was all good to go AFAIK until we had the opt-out conversation (I said I wasn't going to. Cue emails and offers of meetings with various managers etc.) and now I've been waiting three days to get sight of the contract. At this point my opinion of Agency1 is not great.

The question is: should I give Agency2 a call and ask about them putting me into the role? The only thing I've signed with Agency1 is a registration document which mentions I can't work direct during a temp assignment without the client paying intro/transfer fee.

The other question is: the Interview that got Away - is it worth speaking to that agent on the off chance they didn't appoint, what happens if this is just last minute jitters and it all works out OK and I've messed them around going to an interview?

Cheers all.

You've had a welcome pack from the client. Phone them and tell them you're looking forward to starting on Monday if that suits them, but you've been waiting for the paperwork from the agency. Could they give the agency a nudge.

[billybiro]

Swapping agents at this point is a complete no no. Agent 1 will make its his life mission to make sure you don't get the gig. They'll give the client so much grief there is a good chance they'll bin you.
Even if agency 1 had made it complicated they've still put all the effort in to place you so you can see why he'll pop a blood vessel if you swap.

Agents don't often want to deal with Opt In contractors due to the extra obligations and they are within their rights to turn you down if you don't opt out. Bad business but they can. It's possible the other agent my do exactly the same. It's too late for opt out anyway because you've been introduced.
I've yet to see the opt in/out status really make a difference even when it comes to nonpayment etc so what with it being too late and it not being much use I would not be putting a perfectly good gig at risk over it. I'd be signing whatever they want and the get on site.

RE Asking about the missed interview. Nothing stopping you. You'll get nothing if you leave it so what harm can it do. Clients tend to ask for up to 3 CVs from each agent so the chance it hasn't been resourced will be pretty darn slim though.

I'm not so sure.

Given the OP's case laid out here, I don't see what he's got to lose. I'm not saying that switching to Agency2 won't cause Agency1 to have a sh!t-fit and cause a total ruckus, of course they will, and it's quite possible the client will want none of it and distance themselves (i.e. drop like a hot potato) both Agency1 and the OP as a candidate.

But then what's the alternative here? Stay with Agency1 who are now clearly playing hard-ball about getting OP to opt out (whether that's actually possible or not due having already met the client is irrelevant) and withholding the presentation of a legitimate contract for the OP to sign in order to start work with the client? Sounds like the client could just as easily get tired of waiting (and you can bet that when talking with the client, the agency will paint the delay as entirely the candidate's fault) and bin OP in favour of someone else anyway.

I don't disagree with NLUK in terms of what the fallout might be but for me personally, if I were in this exact situation, I'd be tempted to give it a go switching agencies on the basis that I (probably) have nothing to lose.

[Yorga]

Swapping agents at this point is a complete no no.

Yeah I can see that now thanks, I was just so fed up of it all when I posted earlier. Anyhoo the contract has come through and it's with QDOS at the moment so let's see what happens.

[northernladuk]

Swapping agents at this point is a complete no no. Agent 1 will make its his life mission to make sure you don't get the gig. They'll give the client so much grief there is a good chance they'll bin you.
Even if agency 1 had made it complicated they've still put all the effort in to place you so you can see why he'll pop a blood vessel if you swap.

Agents don't often want to deal with Opt In contractors due to the extra obligations and they are within their rights to turn you down if you don't opt out. Bad business but they can. It's possible the other agent my do exactly the same. It's too late for opt out anyway because you've been introduced.
I've yet to see the opt in/out status really make a difference even when it comes to nonpayment etc so what with it being too late and it not being much use I would not be putting a perfectly good gig at risk over it. I'd be signing whatever they want and the get on site.

RE Asking about the missed interview. Nothing stopping you. You'll get nothing if you leave it so what harm can it do. Clients tend to ask for up to 3 CVs from each agent so the chance it hasn't been resourced will be pretty darn slim though.

[Yorga]

Apologies if this is covered elsewhere, I've searched and can only find posts about switching agencies at renewal time rather than this situation.

I applied for a couple of job ads without knowing 100% they were the same role through different agencies . Agency1 called and I agreed they could represent. Agency2 called next day and after going through all the usuals it became apparent that it was the same job as I had discussed with Agency1 so I said thanks I'm already being represented. Had a phone interview with client and received an offer the next day which I said I would accept (and here is where I made Newbie Mistake Number 1 - I was offered an interview for a different role which I turned down on the basis I had "accepted" a role......)

This is first contract so went through the rigmarole of creating Ltd., accountant etc. I've had a welcome pack .doc from the client explaining everything and they are expecting me to start soon. The only fly in the ointment is I still haven't had the contract through from Agency1. It was all good to go AFAIK until we had the opt-out conversation (I said I wasn't going to. Cue emails and offers of meetings with various managers etc.) and now I've been waiting three days to get sight of the contract. At this point my opinion of Agency1 is not great.

The question is: should I give Agency2 a call and ask about them putting me into the role? The only thing I've signed with Agency1 is a registration document which mentions I can't work direct during a temp assignment without the client paying intro/transfer fee.

The other question is: the Interview that got Away - is it worth speaking to that agent on the off chance they didn't appoint, what happens if this is just last minute jitters and it all works out OK and I've messed them around going to an interview?

Cheers all.