Reply to: rate expectations

[SueEllen]

Rate expectations:

The problem is: The OP is receiving what he needs (location, length of the gig, rate, etc...) In 1 of 10 approaches. He realize that probably they are fishing. He is asking what we use to do.

What would you do?

Part of it is experience dealing with different agents as you learn over the years how to ask the right questions to get the agent to reveal all and notice the tactics that fishing agents tend to use, that way you can end the fishing calls as quickly as possible. In fact some agents are so shocked by how quickly I cut them off and say bye when they are fishing, they ring back leaving a voice message saying they must have been accidentally cut off.

I could put more information on here but it would mean the agents who are fishing could find this thread using Google and alter their tactics.

[Bee]

Not necessarily.

Over the years I've had contracts which have started from:
1. Agents who will send a full detailed role descriptions with the client's name.
2. Agents who will sent a list of seemingly random words which are skills and technologies with the client's name.
3. Agents who will sent a link to client's website and not much else.
4. Agents who phone up for a talk then don't bother to send out an email but suddenly spring an interview on you within an hour or a day.

The thing fishing agents have in common is that they are preoccupied with your previous clients and the names of "managers" who can give you a reference. Agents with roles will not waste time demanding references there and then.

Rate expectations:

The problem is: The OP is receiving what he needs (location, length of the gig, rate, etc...) In 1 of 10 approaches. He realize that probably they are fishing. He is asking what we use to do.

What would you do?

[SueEllen]

If the agent doesn't send the job description then it's a fake role (or they think you're not worth wasting the time on). However it does mean you have to have the conversation.

So it might not be the best approach but it is a valid approach.

Not necessarily.

Over the years I've had contracts which have started from:
1. Agents who will send a full detailed role descriptions with the client's name.
2. Agents who will sent a list of seemingly random words which are skills and technologies with the client's name.
3. Agents who will sent a link to client's website and not much else.
4. Agents who phone up for a talk then don't bother to send out an email but suddenly spring an interview on you within an hour or a day.

The thing fishing agents have in common is that they are preoccupied with your previous clients and the names of "managers" who can give you a reference. Agents with roles will not waste time demanding references there and then.

[SueEllen]

Could you please tell us why?

Someone kindly answered your question for me.

[northernladuk]

Could you please tell us why?

My guess is this.

http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...ml#post2325108

[LondonManc]

I receive job descriptions or job details from the agencies, in fact, role description or job description means the same thing.

Is this important for the thread or for your ego?

He's trying to make you a better person

[Bee]

Indeed but in the context of the thread we've got someone that needs educating on the difference between permie mentality and a contractor one so getting the terminology right is a good start.

I receive job descriptions or job details from the agencies, in fact, role description or job description means the same thing.

Is this important for the thread or for your ego?

[LondonManc]

Indeed but in the context of the thread we've got someone that needs educating on the difference between permie mentality and a contractor one so getting the terminology right is a good start.

Bee could have called it role description and meant permie and you'd have been none the wiser

To be fair, Educating Bee isn't the priority of this thread and you've side-tracked it. Best leave cojak to do the needful.

[Bee]

This isn't relevant to the thread.

Could you please tell us why?

[northernladuk]

I think NLUK has gone into anal terminology mode. We have role descriptions, not job descriptions (which can also be called role descriptions).

Indeed but in the context of the thread we've got someone that needs educating on the difference between permie mentality and a contractor one so getting the terminology right is a good start.

[Bee]

I didn't think it was either because she said 'If you don’t know the expectations, you don’t know if you are a fit or not or negotiate the rate '

Are you serious!!
Do you know what an expectation is, and what for? It's English!

And Bee... It's not a job description. That's what permies have.

[LondonManc]

If the agent doesn't send the job description then it's a fake role (or they think you're not worth wasting the time on). However it does mean you have to have the conversation.

So it might not be the best approach but it is a valid approach.

I think NLUK has gone into anal terminology mode. We have role descriptions, not job descriptions (which can also be called role descriptions).

[VillageContractor]

I didn't think it was either because she said 'If you don’t know the expectations, you don’t know if you are a fit or not or negotiate the rate '

The OP is about trying to weed out agents fishing. Nothing to do with fit or negotiate rate.

And Bee... It's not a job description. That's what permies have.

If the agent doesn't send the job description then it's a fake role (or they think you're not worth wasting the time on). However it does mean you have to have the conversation.

So it might not be the best approach but it is a valid approach.

[northernladuk]

Yes it is

I didn't think it was either because she said 'If you don’t know the expectations, you don’t know if you are a fit or not or negotiate the rate '

The OP is about trying to weed out agents fishing. Nothing to do with fit or negotiate rate.

And Bee... It's not a job description. That's what permies have.

[VillageContractor]

This isn't relevant to the thread.

Yes it is