Reply to: Getting out of Development

[Zero Liability]

Yep cause coding is a booming market

I meant it in the sense that it's a prerequisite for going into development. Since you seem quite knowledgeable about this stuff, which would you consider to be booming markets worth further investigation?

[northernladuk]

I had given recruitment a thought before, but you need a particular type of personality for sales jobs, which I don't have.

I think at the very least I'd like to learn how to code, and go from there whether it is a career shift I'd like to take further. It's hard to say whether I'd like it or not without trying first.

Yep cause coding is a booming market

[Zero Liability]

You'll need to deal with tedious idiots who think everythings crap unless they came up with the idea, even when it's what you suggested it 3 weeks ago; kids with 6 months experience being team leads talking down to you; folks who gave up on life who basically no longer care about the quality of what they deliver; hoppers who go place to place leaving messes because they know they don't have to maintain it; business people who think they can easily do your job; needing to retrain constantly because of how fad driven the industry is; no longer being able to find jobs because you got a clue, dropped the fads, only to realise you need to follow those idiot kids to find jobs.

Few will survive that without a love of creating things on the magic box. If you're not already doing that, it's probably not you and if you want to make money, go into sales.

I had given recruitment a thought before, but you need a particular type of personality for sales jobs, which I don't have.

I think at the very least I'd like to learn how to code, and go from there whether it is a career shift I'd like to take further. It's hard to say whether I'd like it or not without trying first.

[fool]

Well I'm still contemplating whether to go in it in the first place; I plan on acquiring some coding skills one way or another, but if I find I like it and I'm good at it, I'd consider development as a possible career shift, but I also want to think about what career options it could open over the longer term. I was originally looking into accountancy, however it has the same outsourcing problems and it isn't remotely as well paid outside the more senior ranks within the Big 4 or some of the mid-tier firms.

You'll need to deal with tedious idiots who think everythings crap unless they came up with the idea, even when it's what you suggested it 3 weeks ago; kids with 6 months experience being team leads talking down to you; folks who gave up on life who basically no longer care about the quality of what they deliver; hoppers who go place to place leaving messes because they know they don't have to maintain it; business people who think they can easily do your job; needing to retrain constantly because of how fad driven the industry is; no longer being able to find jobs because you got a clue, dropped the fads, only to realise you need to follow those idiot kids to find jobs.

Few will survive that without a love of creating things on the magic box. If you're not already doing that, it's probably not you and if you want to make money, go into sales.

I've thought about this. I've certainly had roles for smaller companies where I've been responsible for the bigger picture and have performed the role of an architect.

If I big this up on my CV and get some kind of certification it may lead to a few openings.

If some of the charlies I've worked with can pass as architects, I'm sure I can

Apply for the below market rate roles in the area you want to move to. Big up relevant experience. After 2-3 contracts, start charing market rate.

[Zero Liability]

In my book yes.
I transitioned from pure engineering through engineering design, team leading and then a fluke where I was asked to take over as PM on a contract where I was the chief engineer and site managing anyway, I was actually aiming at becoming a Technical Architect, but I found I liked being a PM.

If you're serious about wanting out of Dev, then decide where you want to go and plan a route, it can't hurt to think it through. Maybe some training courses, business courses and straight forward discussions with folks you know will help. The important thing is to know where you're aiming to get to, the trip can be fun in itself

Well I'm still contemplating whether to go in it in the first place; I plan on acquiring some coding skills one way or another, but if I find I like it and I'm good at it, I'd consider development as a possible career shift, but I also want to think about what career options it could open over the longer term. I was originally looking into accountancy, however it has the same outsourcing problems and it isn't remotely as well paid outside the more senior ranks within the Big 4 or some of the mid-tier firms.

[NibblyPig]

If I make a transition it will be to develop some software myself and sell either it, or the resulting data.

Having worked at numerous companies, and having gained some information about how they work and their competitors and the general market, I think it puts me in a position to develop something along side them, that I can sell to any company in this group.

For example, if you worked for a company selling airline tickets, you could write an API to aggregate 25 airlines that don't offer their own API, host it, and sell access to the airline ticket company that will see it as being more cost effective than doing it in house. Then, having worked for that ticket company and knowing all of their competitors, you could offer it to them as well, and use it to get your foot in the door to develop further projects they might need.

This is my thoughts on the matter.

I'd like to start up my own company, but I don't want to be one of those startups that has to sell most of itself to fund its development, such that 5 years later it's booming but the founder owns a measly few percent.

[TykeMerc]

Would a good way to approach it be to have a medium term exit plan, e.g. moving into a role like an architect?

In my book yes.
I transitioned from pure engineering through engineering design, team leading and then a fluke where I was asked to take over as PM on a contract where I was the chief engineer and site managing anyway, I was actually aiming at becoming a Technical Architect, but I found I liked being a PM.

If you're serious about wanting out of Dev, then decide where you want to go and plan a route, it can't hurt to think it through. Maybe some training courses, business courses and straight forward discussions with folks you know will help. The important thing is to know where you're aiming to get to, the trip can be fun in itself

[Gumbo Robot]

Would a good way to approach it be to have a medium term exit plan, e.g. moving into a role like an architect?

I've thought about this. I've certainly had roles for smaller companies where I've been responsible for the bigger picture and have performed the role of an architect.

If I big this up on my CV and get some kind of certification it may lead to a few openings.

If some of the charlies I've worked with can pass as architects, I'm sure I can

[Zero Liability]

I'm not a developer, never have been, my technical background was infrastructure and comms, but as a PM I see a lot of development either being directly offshored (still, barking mad I know) or partially offshored. Even though it's not as cost efficient in the long run the accountants just don't see it. They do look for even cheaper dev resources though.
To my mind the architecture role is the pivotal technical function with a long term future, many architects cover the BA bit (which is a role that's disappearing slowly due to there being very few that are actually good BA's, I've worked with a couple that put the rest in context as just documenters) and support the PM work extensively.
Solution design, technical integration and knowledge together with a willingness to attend meetings to help convince the customer that their "bright idea" is actually a bit thick, but here's a workable option.
That's my 5p's worth anyway

Would a good way to approach it be to have a medium term exit plan, e.g. moving into a role like an architect?

[unixman]

As an aside, there are lots of people, permies, who ARE able to endure or enjoy the work as a permie. Is that because they are better than us as contractors, or just different?
Sometimes I feel a little ashamed of myself for getting bored of a contract after x number of months in a gig, yet see the permies around me beavering away with no apparent loss of motivation.

I've had permanent jobs that I really enjoyed. If a job is on your doorstep, varied, exciting, you are learning a lot and have something on common with the other people, and a good manager, life is sweet. That was the case with a couple of jobs when I was younger. Discontent with permydom is perhaps more likely as you get older. You have your own house, therefore travel further to work, therefore you have less in common with colleagues, no five-a-side after work, no bumping into colleagues in nightclubs, you are teaching more than learning, have more responsibility, boring political issues, meetings... Reginald Perrin stuff.

[ShandyDrinker]

A great post from DieScum.

Periodically it's good to take stock and decide if the path we're on is the right one...

[DieScum]

I made the change from pure tech to the tech/business side a few years ago. Loving it. Originally I planned to move towards being more of a trainer but I currently do presales for a vendor.

It's great. Hard work, very demanding but I relish it. A few years ago I was posting on here about I hadn't really been happy at work "in the past six years". Something had to change.

I didn't like sitting at a desk in the same place for months on end, being on the receiving end of the politics and having to do stupid things because I didn't have any say in how things should be approached.

Ended up taking a year off (+ four extremely unpleasant months trying to break back in at entry level in a new field).

Originally thought I might just leave tech behind but after a month on the beach I was logging in to udacity, edx and coursera and devouring the tech courses on there. Had a, slightly half hearted, crack at running my own businesses and that put the ease of making money via traditional contracting/salary in to context. I learnt so much in that year though.

Decided to throw away my previous tech skillset. It was a dying, commoditised skillset in a rather dull niche. I made the choice to only go for roles doing things I'm great at, that I enjoy and that are evergreen (it won't die out in five years time).

I'm really good at presenting and training. So went for that. Interviewing was the pits. It was humiliating. For over a decade I'd never really had to interview. I had this great niche skillset so I just walked into roles. Now I was battling to get a foot in the door somewhere new. I was powerless and it's not a nice place to be. I think a lot of people thought my CV was fake. Great education, great career and now you're going for these entry level roles in a new field. Met some right eejits.

Eventually got my first gig. It was a shambles. They treated me like an intern and there wasn't much to do. But every evening I was sending out the CVs, arranging public speaking appearances, adding to my skills. After six months got a team lead position which was much better.

After 18 months of that I was a commercially skilled, experienced professional in my new field. The one that had looked like such a stretch not so long ago. Now I earn more than I ever have in a field I enjoy.

I look at other guys I used to work with. I remember they hated the tech, never bothered learning anything new, came up with excuse in the book for everything - and they are still doing that.

Being strong at the tech side in a business role is a really, really strong skillset. The first time you write a script to do something that takes them hours or 'can't be done' is fun. It makes your job so much easier. It can be tough to get there - but, for me at least, it's been fantastic.

[Gumbo Robot]

Its more likely the herd instinct of being one of a crowd or not wanting to leave the cosy world of paid holidays \ sick absences, not having to travel more than 15 - 20 minutes to the workplace and the like.

Some permies just dont see it that they may have a marketable skill.

Re the OP, Ive seen people move specialism. They've generally had to start on the bottom rung again and tend not to like that because of the experience they held. Then they seem to think within a couple of weeks they're the 'go to SME' when they're not.

I've done pre-sales before. You have to have the technical skills, obviously, but ability to think on your feet - e.g. when the client says the product doesn't do xyz you knock up an excel solution & tell him it will be a feature in the next release.

As an aside, it used to be great fun going round the trading floors of Amsterdam and Paris. Used to do much of the work with a very sore head.

Actually some of them bloody well love it.

I feel the same way as the OP. Spending 30 minutes in the morning standing, listening to non-technical folk talk for a long time about something I don't care about because we're doing "stand ups" and then spending my time making tickets and going through a Jira kanban board which is a laggy piece of Tulip because some management layer needs to justify their existance, then sitting in hours long retrospectives where non-technical people complain it's hard to keep up with the technical side of the project isn't really what I signed up for.

Very little of that has to do with development but it's almost always an autistic developer pushing the issue and demanding I write user stories that start with "as a user" and end with "or your app won't work" because that's so much more helpful than a story that says "provision servers".

Ah well, I do DevOps now and when they ruin that like they ruined agile, I'll jump on the next buzzword and charge them even more for the luxury of having me ignore them.

Yes, all of that. And it's worse when you have a client who thinks that the smaller your contribution to standups, retrospectives etc the smaller your commitment to " the team".

[TykeMerc]

I am looking into whether it is worth re-specialising and going into it, whilst I'm still fairly young. Is development really that bad a career choice? I figure that even if I end up not liking it, it's still better paid than the vast majority of work out there and it can also lead into roles like business or systems analysis, which benefit from a knowledge of software development.

I'm not a developer, never have been, my technical background was infrastructure and comms, but as a PM I see a lot of development either being directly offshored (still, barking mad I know) or partially offshored. Even though it's not as cost efficient in the long run the accountants just don't see it. They do look for even cheaper dev resources though.
To my mind the architecture role is the pivotal technical function with a long term future, many architects cover the BA bit (which is a role that's disappearing slowly due to there being very few that are actually good BA's, I've worked with a couple that put the rest in context as just documenters) and support the PM work extensively.
Solution design, technical integration and knowledge together with a willingness to attend meetings to help convince the customer that their "bright idea" is actually a bit thick, but here's a workable option.
That's my 5p's worth anyway

[Zero Liability]

I am looking into whether it is worth re-specialising and going into it, whilst I'm still fairly young. Is development really that bad a career choice? I figure that even if I end up not liking it, it's still better paid than the vast majority of work out there and it can also lead into roles like business or systems analysis, which benefit from a knowledge of software development.