Reply to: Leaving Europe?

[meridian]

Who cares what options were there? People were unhappy at growing inequality and wanted to lash out.

Sadly brexit will just accelerate the growth in inequality.

Will it? How do you know?

If only we had some impact assessments that might give us, the people, an idea of the various options available to us so we could decide which path we took that would be the most beneficial for us all.

[BrilloPad]

You must have had a different ballot paper to the rest of us, those weren't the two options I recall seeing.

Who cares what options were there? People were unhappy at growing inequality and wanted to lash out.

Sadly brexit will just accelerate the growth in inequality.

[motoukenin]

No what he means is the UK has not left Europe - we are still geographically located in the continent of Europe - not on mainland Europe as I am sure you are still aware.

What we have done is to get rid of a bunch of politicians.

From all the activity I see happening here in Germany, the financial heart of Europe will be getting a transplant over the next 5 - 7 years, no doubt about it.

[meridian]

Anyway it was a choice between leaving EU and continuing to make people more frustrated with state of the country.

You must have had a different ballot paper to the rest of us, those weren't the two options I recall seeing.

[fatboyslim]

I have a feeling there are going to be some sacrifices along the way and then at the end of it all, when the prices have risen in the shops, the lorries are parked for miles and miles in Folkstone and people struggle a bit more to find those jobs, that some minister is going to make a "hard decision" on freedom of movement to get the "dirty deal" done.

Hope it does not become that desperate, and things are taken care of, before it happens.

Anyway it was a choice between leaving EU and continuing to make people more frustrated with state of the country. The later would have got uglier, leading to rise of far right parties and riots on street. Look at Europe.

This process has created an exit vent, a short term rise in racist attacks but longer term benefit of people taking ownership of country, more engaged, having animated debate about it, no matter what their views are, its very healthy for democracy.
If at the end of the process, people accept that migration is a price to pay for their prosperity, its ok. At least people will get what they wanted.

[BlasterBates]

Yes but I have a lot of faith in London and Brussels to be deeply corrupt, to the point that they can make any deal possible. Thankfully these people we elect have little moral or dogma, a bit of ego may be but that wont stop a good deal.
I doubt anybody is expecting business as usual, there is a price to pay for democracy, people will be a bit poorer, with less jobs around, may be for 15 years, may be bit longer. Most people, I believe are willing to pay that price, including myself.

I have a feeling there are going to be some sacrifices along the way and then at the end of it all, when the prices have risen in the shops, the lorries are parked for miles and miles in Folkstone and people struggle a bit more to find those jobs, that some minister is going to make a "hard decision" on freedom of movement to get the "dirty deal" done.

[fatboyslim]

Older and wiser? I thought the point of getting older was to be more stupid?

Anyway I agree it will be okay in the end. However the next 15 years will be fun! It was never going to be easy to untangle us from the EU.

Yes but I have a lot of faith in London and Brussels to be deeply corrupt, to the point that they can make any deal possible. Thankfully these people we elect have little moral or dogma, a bit of ego may be but that wont stop a good deal.
I doubt anybody is expecting business as usual, there is a price to pay for democracy, people will be a bit poorer, with less jobs around, may be for 15 years, may be bit longer. Most people, I believe are willing to pay that price, including myself.

[BrilloPad]

Things tend to sort themselves out in the end, am optimistic it will all be good... when we are older and wiser we will be telling our grandkids how silly we were, and the fuss we made over nothing.

Older and wiser? I thought the point of getting older was to be more stupid?

Anyway I agree it will be okay in the end. However the next 15 years will be fun! It was never going to be easy to untangle us from the EU.

[fatboyslim]

Things tend to sort themselves out in the end, am optimistic it will all be good... when we are older and wiser we will be telling our grandkids how silly we were, and the fuss we made over nothing.

[BlasterBates]

Europe with the UK as part of it will be limited to Satellite photos, for all other purposes the UK might as well be in the middle of the pacific.

[BlasterBates]

EU, not Europe.

Since virtually every country in Europe is also either in the EU or is a "vassal state" of the EU as Turkey and the Ukraine are, there's not a lot of difference really.

[fatboyslim]

EU, not Europe.

[BlasterBates]

Indeed - but then I do not think a very large percentage of the population will see this as a loss.

Even amongst the remainers how many have ever harboured any desire to go and live and work in Europe?

Yes many people go on holiday to Europe - that will not change.

And I am pretty sure as long as I am not expecting the state to help or expecting to be able to wore there is nothing really stopping me from buying and living in a property in Europe.

No you won't that isn't how the rules work in Germany for example. Sure you can stay in a hotel for 3 months but then you have to leave, you certainly can't go and live in a rented flat because landlords expect you to be registered, but what you can possibly do is buy property, you just can't live in it.

This is not the UK where no-one gives a sh*t once you're there, and the same goes for every other European country except the UK of course.

[original PM]

It's going to be a lot more difficult and you certainly won't be able to contract as self-employed while being resident in the UK.

It will be as "easy" as going to the US or Japan. How many contracts have you done in the US or Japan ?

You won't be phoning an agent who'll simply place you somewhere in Europe.

Indeed - but then I do not think a very large percentage of the population will see this as a loss.

Even amongst the remainers how many have ever harboured any desire to go and live and work in Europe?

Yes many people go on holiday to Europe - that will not change.

And I am pretty sure as long as I am not expecting the state to help or expecting to be able to wore there is nothing really stopping me from buying and living in a property in Europe.

[BlasterBates]

Why do you say that?

I have lost the right to randomly go to another European country and expect to be treated the same as if I was in the UK but it is still possible for me to go and work in Europe.

And the same applies to people from all over the world including EU members who wish to come and work in the UK.

It's going to be a lot more difficult and you certainly won't be able to contract as self-employed while being resident in the UK.

It will be as "easy" as going to the US or Japan. How many contracts have you done in the US or Japan ?

You won't be phoning an agent who'll simply place you somewhere in Europe.