Reply to: I always knew we were right....

[jamesbrown]

Minor point, but there's a difference between legal jurisdiction (where a case would be heard) and governing law (which legal system applies). It's routine to have both specified in the contract when dealing with international clients.

[borderreiver]

That was the impression I got though they may have been happy enough with any company in the UK. I know some people who live in Scotland who have companies registered in England to avoid incorporating a company under Scots law. Does anyone here have a UK company which is registered somewhere which NOT England and Wales?

Personally, I'd be cautious because of the potential difficulty of dealing with companies which operate under different legal systems.

I understand what you mean, but that's just crazy TBH. I assume none of the (English) agents you mention would ever consider doing business with RBS, then?

As someone else just said, the contract just needs to state whose legal jurisdiction applies. Simple ;-)

[SueEllen]

That was the impression I got though they may have been happy enough with any company in the UK. I know some people who live in Scotland who have companies registered in England to avoid incorporating a company under Scots law. Does anyone here have a UK company which is registered somewhere which NOT England and Wales?

Personally, I'd be cautious because of the potential difficulty of dealing with companies which operate under different legal systems.

There is absolutely no difficulty as you simply state in the contract what legal system the contract falls under.

My contracts all state that the laws of England apply. This gets around any laws that the Welsh Assembly Government could put in which would effect the contract.

How do you think organisations do cross border trade?

I would guess that it depends on if he is in the UK for long enough to become resident here for tax purposes. If he is and a client/agency is paying an IOM company there is the risk that at some time in the future HMRC could come after the client/agency for PAYE/NI from the contractor's earnings and they won't want to carry that risk.

If he works in mainland UK for most of the year for many years then he cannot get out of pretending he is not tax resident regardless of whether he spends the weekend in a different tax jurisdiction.

[Wanderer]

What, would they not do business with Scottish or NI ones?

That was the impression I got though they may have been happy enough with any company in the UK. I know some people who live in Scotland who have companies registered in England to avoid incorporating a company under Scots law. Does anyone here have a UK company which is registered somewhere which NOT England and Wales?

Personally, I'd be cautious because of the potential difficulty of dealing with companies which operate under different legal systems.

This feller lived in Douglas and commuted mon-Fri, so I have to assume that his ltd co (or whatever the equivalent is) was set up there.

I would guess that it depends on if he is in the UK for long enough to become resident here for tax purposes. If he is and a client/agency is paying an IOM company there is the risk that at some time in the future HMRC could come after the client/agency for PAYE/NI from the contractor's earnings and they won't want to carry that risk.

[NickNick]

Lots of people in the UK were born in other countries. It doesn't matter where they are "from", what matters is where they are currently resident for tax purposes....

For many years, agencies have been telling me that they will only do business with a company which is registered in England and Wales and they won't deal with off-shore ones. Of course there is nothing to stop a non tax resident contractor setting up a company in England which pays all the money to one in the IOM, so long as the correct amount of tax is paid in the UK.

This feller lived in Douglas and commuted mon-Fri, so I have to assume that his ltd co (or whatever the equivalent is) was set up there.

[Freelancer Financials]

Good point. In fact MOntpelier setup their own mortgage broker to get round this. They got me a mortgage.

Those were different times BrilloPad, it's all changed now. I don't think they have a mortgage broker anymore.

There is no way to get round this today, unless a broker disguises the trading structure as working through PAYE Umbrella. This is fraud.

[borderreiver]

For many years, agencies have been telling me that they will only do business with a company which is registered in England and Wales

What, would they not do business with Scottish or NI ones?

[BrilloPad]

Just simply tell them that they will struggle to get a mortgage on these schemes.

Virtually all the high street lenders have made it clear that they do not want applications from buyers who operate under these Offshore Umbrella/Loan Trust schemes.

The only reason some get a mortgage is because dodgy mortgage brokers disguise them as working through PAYE brollies.

Good point. In fact MOntpelier setup their own mortgage broker to get round this. They got me a mortgage.

[Wanderer]

Appropos of nothing, I work with a contractor from the Isle of Man. No, really. And his contracts are becoming fewer an farther between as more and more agencies see the address and won't touch him with a barge pole.

Lots of people in the UK were born in other countries. It doesn't matter where they are "from", what matters is where they are currently resident for tax purposes....

For many years, agencies have been telling me that they will only do business with a company which is registered in England and Wales and they won't deal with off-shore ones. Of course there is nothing to stop a non tax resident contractor setting up a company in England which pays all the money to one in the IOM, so long as the correct amount of tax is paid in the UK.

[BlasterBates]

Appropos of nothing, I work with a contractor from the Isle of Man. No, really. And his contracts are becoming fewer an farther between as more and more agencies see the address and won't touch him with a barge pole.

Well even if he is from the Isle of Man he should be taxing himself in the UK even for a short term project, so he should be using a UK Ltd, which should have an address.

Non-residents are still liable for tax on the work they do in the UK.

[NickNick]

Some of the bigger recruiters already have a policy of not dealing with anything dodgy. Contractors either have to operate through their own company or be on PAYE.

Appropos of nothing, I work with a contractor from the Isle of Man. No, really. And his contracts are becoming fewer an farther between as more and more agencies see the address and won't touch him with a barge pole.

[cojak]

Just simply tell them that they will struggle to get a mortgage on these schemes.

Virtually all the high street lenders have made it clear that they do not want applications from buyers who operate under these Offshore Umbrella/Loan Trust schemes.

The only reason some get a mortgage is because dodgy mortgage brokers disguise them as working through PAYE brollies.

A useful point to know.

[Freelancer Financials]

Don't UK lenders only look at UK taxable earnings?

No.

HTH

If they're UK residents, they will only use UK TAXABLE EARNINGS.

[Freelancer Financials]

How on earth do people operating through an Offshore Umbrellas prove their earnings for affordability when they're applying for a mortgage or finance?

They're P60 and tax returns only show a small minimum wage salary, so how do they do it. Self cert Mortgages were banned a few years back?

I suppose they can't get a loan unless they're buying a shed.

That's correct. Unless they are a cash buyer!

[Freelancer Financials]

So how do you think we can get the message across to newbies? Do you reckon it would make a difference if recruiters were better educated about the difference between umbrella companies and dodgy schemes claiming to be brollies?

Just simply tell them that they will struggle to get a mortgage on these schemes.

Virtually all the high street lenders have made it clear that they do not want applications from buyers who operate under these Offshore Umbrella/Loan Trust schemes.

The only reason some get a mortgage is because dodgy mortgage brokers disguise them as working through PAYE brollies.