Reply to: IR35 - HMRC's View

[The Wikir Man]

Sorry, gotta go now.

PS AtW's leaving too. FYI.

Are you suggesting that you are an(other) AtW sockie?

[SueEllen]

8 million may not have jobs; only about 2 million don't have one and want one.

Where did you get that figure from?

There are lots of people not on the unemployment figures because they are either students, getting pensions/pension credit, carers of family or part of a couple but actually want to work.

None of the people I know who fall in those categories (apart from the one in the couple who has been down to the job centre) have ever been asked if they want to work.

Anyway this has gone off the topic of contractors paying the same tax as employees.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

Sorry, gotta go now.

PS AtW's leaving too. FYI.

Ok. Bye.

[Tarquin Farquhar]

Sorry, gotta go now.

PS AtW's leaving too. FYI.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

Are there really 8 million jobs available? Because that's how many people don't have one.

8 million may not have jobs; only about 2 million don't have one and want one.

[RockTheBoat]

Are there really 8 million jobs available? Because that's how many people don't have one.

the results are now in and Tarquin Marx has been voted WUM of the week

[Tarquin Farquhar]

There are ALWAYS jobs available.

Are there really 8 million jobs available? Because that's how many people don't have one.

[Fred Bloggs]

There are ALWAYS jobs available. One of the biggest issues we face right now in the UK is that too many folk are too disincentivised by the social security system from taking those jobs because they'd be worse off or no better off by working. This situation has actually been made much worse by labour since they wanted millions of voters to be trapped into voting labour in case the scary, nasty tories took away their benefits.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

So anybody who is unemployed should be blamed for it themselves, it's their fault for not creating a job?

What if the same applies to enrepreneurial activity as applies to employment: there just is not and cannot be enough of it to go round?

Who said that people should be 'blamed' for being unemployed? I merely said there is an alternative to standard employment for anyone who is desperate enough to work.

[Tarquin Farquhar]

People do not have to rely on jobs being 'provided' when they could be created - hence why entrepreneurilism is essential to any econonomy

So anybody who is unemployed should be blamed for it themselves, it's their fault for not creating a job?

What if the same applies to enrepreneurial activity as applies to employment: there just is not and cannot be enough of it to go round?

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

What about those who can not work, not because they are disabled, but because there are millions more people than there are jobs?

People do not have to rely on jobs being 'provided' when they could be created - hence why entrepreneurilism is essential to any econonomy

[Tarquin Farquhar]

The welfare state was originally introduced to aid people who were unable to help themselves and I doubt that anyone would disagree that was a good thing. I am quite happy for everyone to pay 20% tax to ensure the that the welfare state continues to help people who are unable to help themselves. I am also certain that 20% tax across the board would be more than sufficient to fund it. The additional 'fair' taxes from the 'fat cats' are more likely to be used to fund those who will not work rather than those who cannot.

What about those who can not work, not because they are disabled, but because there are millions more people than there are jobs?

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

For example when someone is disabled; or a parent, child, or spouse is disabled.

The welfare state was originally introduced to aid people who were unable to help themselves and I doubt that anyone would disagree that was a good thing. I am quite happy for everyone to pay 20% tax to ensure the that the welfare state continues to help people who are unable to help themselves. I am also certain that 20% tax across the board would be more than sufficient to fund it. The additional 'fair' taxes from the 'fat cats' are more likely to be used to fund those who will not work rather than those who cannot.

[Tarquin Farquhar]

Give me an example of 'through no fault of their own'

For example when someone is disabled; or a parent, child, or spouse is disabled.

[Fred Bloggs]

You may have a point there Fred